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From: olcott <polcott333@gmail.com>
Newsgroups: comp.theory,sci.logic
Subject: Deciders are ONLY accountable for their actual inputs ---
Date: Sun, 2 Jun 2024 08:46:30 -0500
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On 6/2/2024 2:56 AM, Mikko wrote:
> On 2024-06-01 14:44:50 +0000, olcott said:
> 
>> On 6/1/2024 2:56 AM, Mikko wrote:
>>> On 2024-05-31 14:25:40 +0000, olcott said:
>>>
>>>> On 5/31/2024 2:50 AM, Fred. Zwarts wrote:
>>>>> Op 31.mei.2024 om 00:01 schreef olcott:
>>>>>> On 5/30/2024 4:54 PM, joes wrote:
>>>>>>> Am Thu, 30 May 2024 09:55:24 -0500 schrieb olcott:
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> typedef int (*ptr)();  // ptr is pointer to int function in C
>>>>>>>> 00       int H(ptr p, ptr i);
>>>>>>>> 01       int D(ptr p)
>>>>>>>> 02       {
>>>>>>>> 03         int Halt_Status = H(p, p);
>>>>>>>> 04         if (Halt_Status)
>>>>>>>> 05           HERE: goto HERE;
>>>>>>>> 06         return Halt_Status;
>>>>>>>> 07       }
>>>>>>>> 08
>>>>>>>> 09       int main()
>>>>>>>> 10       {
>>>>>>>> 11         H(D,D);
>>>>>>>> 12         return 0;
>>>>>>>> 13       }
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> The left hand-side are line numbers of correct C code.
>>>>>>>> This code does compile and does conform to c17.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Everyone with sufficient knowledge of C can easily determine that D
>>>>>>>> correctly emulated by any *pure function* H (using an x86 emulator)
>>>>>>>> cannot possibly reach its own simulated final state at line 06 
>>>>>>>> and halt.
>>>>>>> Yeah, of course not, if H doesn’t halt.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> To actually understand my words (as in an actual honest dialogue)
>>>>>> you must pay careful attention to every single word. Maybe you
>>>>>> had no idea that *pure functions* must always halt.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Or maybe you did not know that every computation that never reaches
>>>>>> its own final state *DOES NOT HALT* even if it stops running because
>>>>>> it is no longer simulated.
>>>>>
>>>>> Since the claim is that H is also a computation, it holds for H, as 
>>>>> well. That means that H *DOES NOT HALT* even if it stops running 
>>>>> because it is no longer simulated.
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>> *pure function H definitely halts you are confused*
>>>
>>> A pure function does not halt (in C that means that a pure function
>>> does not call exit). A pure function returns.
>>>
>>
>> When a pure function returns this is the equivalent of the theory
>> of computation halting.
> 
> In ceratin sense, yes. But the term "pure function" is mainly used
> in a different context where the word "halting" has a more specific
> meaning.
> 

I need to maintain a constant mapping between theory of computation
terminology and software engineering terminology.

Computable Function(comp sci) <is equivalent to> Pure function(SE)
I want it to be easy for software engineers to understand my proof.

Only software engineers will understand that DD correctly simulated
by HH had different behavior than DD(DD). Comp Sci people allow Comp Sci
dogma to overrule verified facts.

When I pinned Richard down on this he simply said that he does not care 
that DD correctly simulated by HH has different behavior than DD(DD).

It turns out that DD correctly simulated by HH <is> the behavior that
the input to HH(DD,DD) specifies. Deciders are ONLY accountable for
their actual inputs. Deciders compute the mapping FROM THEIR INPUTS...

-- 
Copyright 2024 Olcott "Talent hits a target no one else can hit; Genius
hits a target no one else can see." Arthur Schopenhauer