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Path: ...!feeds.phibee-telecom.net!3.eu.feeder.erje.net!feeder.erje.net!eternal-september.org!feeder3.eternal-september.org!news.eternal-september.org!.POSTED!not-for-mail From: "Michael F. Stemper" <michael.stemper@gmail.com> Newsgroups: rec.arts.sf.written Subject: =?UTF-8?Q?Re=3a_=e2=80=9cTop_10_Space_Opera_Books_and_Series?= =?UTF-8?B?4oCd?= Date: Fri, 7 Jun 2024 16:29:14 -0500 Organization: A noiseless patient Spider Lines: 55 Message-ID: <v3vu3a$283qb$1@dont-email.me> References: <v3dc4d$2cmed$1@dont-email.me> <v3j2v7$3it3b$1@dont-email.me> <lc5151FpkphU1@mid.individual.net> <20240607a@crcomp.net> <lch587FremgU1@mid.individual.net> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Injection-Date: Fri, 07 Jun 2024 23:29:14 +0200 (CEST) Injection-Info: dont-email.me; posting-host="cf3fc3a36abb39e7ccadd93ef3246d50"; logging-data="2363211"; mail-complaints-to="abuse@eternal-september.org"; posting-account="U2FsdGVkX18PzfL1Ca/nAMOGM0NX7QJ7KbgCteho+0Q=" User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (X11; Linux x86_64; rv:102.0) Gecko/20100101 Thunderbird/102.11.0 Cancel-Lock: sha1:92AB3mumbgIAu7UGe3UkLru05CY= In-Reply-To: <lch587FremgU1@mid.individual.net> Content-Language: en-US Bytes: 3288 On 07/06/2024 14.27, Ted Nolan <tednolan> wrote: > In article <20240607a@crcomp.net>, Don <g@crcomp.net> wrote: >> Ted Nolan wrote: >>> Lynn McGuire wrote: >>>> Christian Weisgerber wrote: >>>>> Lynn McGuire wrote: >>>>> >>>>>> ???Top 10 Space Opera Books and Series??? >>>>>> 1A. The Foundation Series by Issac Asimov - yes >>>>> >>>>> Whut!?? That's no space opera. >>>> >>>> What genre is Foundation then ? >>> >>> SF? >> >> "What's seen can not be unseen" >> >> "What's done can not be undone" - _Macbeth_ (1606) >> >> "Things done can not be undone" >> - Francis Bacon's Promus of Formularies and Elegancies (1596) >> >> >> >> [Foundation] is a story about social engineering. A mathematician >> and a group of academic intellectuals decide to save civilization >> by manipulating history, and their plan leads to a Second Empire. >> The idea of giving votes to plebeians simply never comes up. >> >> _Transhuman and Subhuman_ (Wright) >> >> Did Asimov and Campbell create _Foundation_'s psychohistory as an >> allegory for Kenesian economics and Baconian scientism, without >> realizing it? >> > > Well to be fair, Seldon and the initial Foundation settlers were products > of an Imperial system, so they were never going to be democrats. > I think Foundation had settled down into some sort of oligarchy by the time > the Mule put paid to the Plan, but my memory is hazy. Well, the Foundation went from a democracy under Salvor Hardin to a plutocracy in the wake of Hober Mallow, to, as you said, an oligarchy. By the time that the Mule came along, it was an autocracy under Indbur III. The Mule then absorbed it into *his* autocracy. It's not specifically addressed, but by the time "The Search by the Foundation" takes place, it *seems* to have become more democratic. If I recall correctly, _Foundation's Edge_ is driven by a Mayoral campaign issue. -- Michael F. Stemper Psalm 82:3-4