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Path: ...!news.mixmin.net!eternal-september.org!feeder3.eternal-september.org!news.eternal-september.org!.POSTED!not-for-mail From: olcott <polcott333@gmail.com> Newsgroups: comp.theory,sci.logic Subject: Re: D correctly simulated by H proved for THREE YEARS --- Date: Mon, 10 Jun 2024 09:36:09 -0500 Organization: A noiseless patient Spider Lines: 81 Message-ID: <v4730r$ggn5$1@dont-email.me> References: <v45tec$4q15$1@dont-email.me> <v46drt$3i580$1@i2pn2.org> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Injection-Date: Mon, 10 Jun 2024 16:36:11 +0200 (CEST) Injection-Info: dont-email.me; posting-host="f6820c6f88a6ab7f47362bcc86c8cb3a"; logging-data="541413"; mail-complaints-to="abuse@eternal-september.org"; posting-account="U2FsdGVkX1+grAJfzeF2z3yQpv6Y+3WC" User-Agent: Mozilla Thunderbird Cancel-Lock: sha1:cLGLC8063BYhbwqgTRMrnMVVm8s= Content-Language: en-US In-Reply-To: <v46drt$3i580$1@i2pn2.org> Bytes: 5023 On 6/10/2024 3:35 AM, joes wrote: > Am Sun, 09 Jun 2024 22:54:52 -0500 schrieb olcott: >> On 5/29/2021 2:26 PM, olcott wrote: >> https://groups.google.com/g/comp.theory/c/dTvIY5NX6b4/m/cHR2ZPgPBAAJ >> >> THE ONLY POSSIBLE WAY for D simulated by H to have the same behavior as >> the directly executed D(D) is for the instructions of D to be >> incorrectly simulated by H (details provided below). >> >> _D() >> [00000cfc](01) 55 push ebp >> [00000cfd](02) 8bec mov ebp,esp >> [00000cff](03) 8b4508 mov eax,[ebp+08] >> [00000d02](01) 50 push eax ; push D >> [00000d03](03) 8b4d08 mov ecx,[ebp+08] >> [00000d06](01) 51 push ecx ; push D >> [00000d07](05) e800feffff call 00000b0c ; call H >> [00000d0c](03) 83c408 add esp,+08 >> [00000d0f](02) 85c0 test eax,eax >> [00000d11](02) 7404 jz 00000d17 >> [00000d13](02) 33c0 xor eax,eax >> [00000d15](02) eb05 jmp 00000d1c >> [00000d17](05) b801000000 mov eax,00000001 >> [00000d1c](01) 5d pop ebp >> [00000d1d](01) c3 ret Size in >> bytes:(0034) [00000d1d] >> >> In order for D simulated by H to have the same behavior as the directly >> executed D(D) H must ignore the instruction at machine address >> [00000d07]. *That is an incorrect simulation of D* > > I don't understand. Does D(D) ignore the call to H(D,D)? > H does not ignore that instruction and simulates itself simulating D. The simulated H outputs its own execution trace of D. The directly executed D(D) reaps the benefit of D correctly simulated by H proving that *its input never halts* Begin Local Halt Decider Simulation at Machine Address:cfc ...[00000cfc][00211839][0021183d](01) 55 push ebp ...[00000cfd][00211839][0021183d](02) 8bec mov ebp,esp ...[00000cff][00211839][0021183d](03) 8b4508 mov eax,[ebp+08] ...[00000d02][00211835][00000cfc](01) 50 push eax ; push D ...[00000d03][00211835][00000cfc](03) 8b4d08 mov ecx,[ebp+08] ...[00000d06][00211831][00000cfc](01) 51 push ecx ; push D ...[00000d07][0021182d][00000d0c](05) e800feffff call 00000b0c ; call H This call to H is simulated H. We can tell that it is the simulated H is providing this trace because it has a different virtual machine stack. *The simulated H derives this execution trace of D* machine stack stack machine assembly address address data code language ======== ======== ======== =============== ============= ...[00000cfc][0025c261][0025c265](01) 55 push ebp ...[00000cfd][0025c261][0025c265](02) 8bec mov ebp,esp ...[00000cff][0025c261][0025c265](03) 8b4508 mov eax,[ebp+08] ...[00000d02][0025c25d][00000cfc](01) 50 push eax ; push D ...[00000d03][0025c25d][00000cfc](03) 8b4d08 mov ecx,[ebp+08] ...[00000d06][0025c259][00000cfc](01) 51 push ecx ; push D ...[00000d07][0025c255][00000d0c](05) e800feffff call 00000b0c ; call H Infinitely Nested Simulation Detected Simulation Stopped Because the H(D,D) that D(D) calls correctly recognizes the its input DOES NOT HALT, it correctly aborts the simulation of this input causing the directly executed D(D) to halt. I proved that D simulated by H can only have the same behavior as the directly executed D(D) when D is simulated by H incorrectly. This requires D simulated by H to skip over the machine address [00000d07] and not call H(D,D) to simulate itself again. D simulated by H does not do that. It simulates itself simulating D. -- Copyright 2024 Olcott "Talent hits a target no one else can hit; Genius hits a target no one else can see." Arthur Schopenhauer