Path: ...!eternal-september.org!feeder3.eternal-september.org!news.eternal-september.org!.POSTED!not-for-mail
From: FPP <fredp1571@gmail.com>
Newsgroups: rec.arts.tv
Subject: Re: 5th Circuit Strikes Down Bump Stock Ban
Date: Thu, 20 Jun 2024 22:08:23 -0400
Organization: Ph'nglui Mglw'nafh Cthulhu R'lyeh Wgah'nagl Fhtagn.
Lines: 181
Message-ID: <v52nan$2v630$5@dont-email.me>
References: <P8OcnfwhaeSXPiT-nZ2dnZfqn_adnZ2d@giganews.com>
 <v4i2m6$30bm2$1@dont-email.me>
 <atropos-25D624.12335314062024@news.giganews.com>
 <v4ih8u$336lr$1@dont-email.me>
 <atropos-C652A7.15471614062024@news.giganews.com>
 <17d91fbd5fad865f$338100$533214$2d54864@news.newsdemon.com>
 <v4kgh9$3i0t8$1@dont-email.me>
 <17d9412e82a8a311$8843$3053472$46d50c60@news.newsdemon.com>
 <atropos-13D763.17305115062024@news.giganews.com>
 <v4s1kl$1c3jr$5@dont-email.me>
 <atropos-B5B6C7.14031818062024@news.giganews.com>
 <v4t1nu$1ig6v$2@dont-email.me>
 <atropos-5889D5.18473418062024@news.giganews.com>
 <v4tfnl$1ons5$2@dont-email.me>
 <atropos-C71DF5.19385218062024@news.giganews.com>
 <v4v8jq$23o16$1@dont-email.me>
 <atropos-A285B6.12133319062024@news.giganews.com>
 <v4vh5f$258cf$2@dont-email.me>
 <atropos-35247F.16282619062024@news.giganews.com>
 <v52kf9$2qv7o$1@dont-email.me>
 <atropos-3C4CB7.18492520062024@news.giganews.com>
Reply-To: fredp1571@gmail.com
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=windows-1252; format=flowed
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit
Injection-Date: Fri, 21 Jun 2024 04:08:24 +0200 (CEST)
Injection-Info: dont-email.me; posting-host="135701bad7255964217cc25f17b69a9f";
	logging-data="3119200"; mail-complaints-to="abuse@eternal-september.org";	posting-account="U2FsdGVkX1/YHblncGct/j6F3LDxsjoj"
User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Macintosh; Intel Mac OS X 10.14; rv:78.0)
 Gecko/20100101 Thunderbird/78.10.0
Cancel-Lock: sha1:4K/8OJQJ1knbZlY0uirgw5KokAU=
In-Reply-To: <atropos-3C4CB7.18492520062024@news.giganews.com>
Content-Language: en-US
Bytes: 10468

On 6/20/24 9:49 PM, BTR1701 wrote:
> In article <v52kf9$2qv7o$1@dont-email.me>, FPP <fredp1571@gmail.com>
> wrote:
> 
>> On 6/19/24 7:28 PM, BTR1701 wrote:
>>> In article <v4vh5f$258cf$2@dont-email.me>,
>>>    moviePig <nobody@nowhere.com> wrote:
>>>
>>>> On 6/19/2024 3:13 PM, BTR1701 wrote:
>>>>> In article <v4v8jq$23o16$1@dont-email.me>,
>>>>>     moviePig <nobody@nowhere.com> wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>> On 6/18/2024 10:38 PM, BTR1701 wrote:
>>>>>>> In article <v4tfnl$1ons5$2@dont-email.me>,
>>>>>>>      moviePig <nobody@nowhere.com> wrote:
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> On 6/18/2024 9:47 PM, BTR1701 wrote:
>>>>>>>>> In article <v4t1nu$1ig6v$2@dont-email.me>,
>>>>>>>>>       moviePig <nobody@nowhere.com> wrote:
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> On 6/18/2024 5:03 PM, BTR1701 wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>> In article <v4s1kl$1c3jr$5@dont-email.me>, FPP
>>>>>>>>>>> <fredp1571@gmail.com>
>>>>>>>>>>> wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>> On 6/15/24 8:30 PM, BTR1701 wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>>>> In article
>>>>>>>>>>>>> <17d9412e82a8a311$8843$3053472$46d50c60@news.newsdemon.com>,
>>>>>>>>>>>>>         trotsky <gmsingh@email.com> wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> On 6/15/24 11:46 AM, moviePig wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> On 6/15/2024 4:20 AM, trotsky wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> On 6/14/24 5:47 PM, BTR1701 wrote:
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> The Federal Firearms Act of 1934
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>     From wiki:
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> The current National Firearms Act (NFA) defines a number of
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> categories of regulated firearms. These weapons are
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> collectively
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> known as NFA firearms and include the following:
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Machine guns:
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> "any weapon which shoots, is designed to shoot, or can be
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> readily restored to shoot, automatically more than one shot,
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> without manual reloading, by a single function of the trigger.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> The term shall also include the frame or receiver of any such
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> weapon, any part designed and intended solely and exclusively,
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> or combination of parts designed and intended, for use in
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> converting a weapon into a machinegun, and any combination of
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> parts from which a machinegun can be assembled if such parts
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> are
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> in the possession or under the control of a person."[10]
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> So, bump-stocks are patently a "workaround" for a law whose
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> intent is patently obvious. Not exactly a triumph of sanity.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> "A work around" is accurate. And the spirit of the law is far
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> more
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> important, obviously, than the letter of the law
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>> Oh, cool! I see Hutt the Fuck-Up Fairy has visited us again!
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>> No, Hutt, you're unsurprisingly about as absolutely wrong as you
>>>>>>>>>>>>> can be yet again.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>> The letter of the law is obviously paramount in the context of
>>>>>>>>>>>>> jurisprudential determination as evidenced by the 1000-page
>>>>>>>>>>>>> statutes
>>>>>>>>>>>>> we have coming out of Congress, millions of pages of
>>>>>>>>>>>>> administrative
>>>>>>>>>>>>> regulations, and the multi-page click-thrus of tiny and near-
>>>>>>>>>>>>> hieroglyphic legalese that you have to agree to just to use a
>>>>>>>>>>>>> piece of software.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>> If all we needed to concern ourselves with was a law's "spirit",
>>>>>>>>>>>>> then none of that would be necessary.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>> I'd elaborate further but I don't have the time or the crayons to
>>>>>>>>>>>>> explain it to you. Jeezus, Hutt, if I wanted to kill myself, I'd
>>>>>>>>>>>>> climb your ego and jump to your IQ.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>> And how does using a bump stock differ from a fully automatic
>>>>>>>>>>>> machine
>>>>>>>>>>>> gun?
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> With a bump stock, for every round fired, a separate trigger pull
>>>>>>>>>>> occurs.
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> With a machine gun, one one trigger pull is required to fire
>>>>>>>>>>> multiple
>>>>>>>>>>> rounds.
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> Also, the rate of fire of a bump stock-equipped rifle is
>>>>>>>>>>> significantly
>>>>>>>>>>> slower than a rifle firing on full-auto.
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> So, this 15-sec. video is a lie?
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=brrecvXhRVc
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> I don't know what you're talking about. You can clearly see the bump
>>>>>>>>> device using the recoil (and Newton's Third Law) to reset the trigger
>>>>>>>>> after every round.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> What I'm seeing is a NOT "significantly slower" rate of fire.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> The bump device I used produce a fast rate of fire but not as fast as
>>>>>>> full-auto rifle. Perhaps this is a different model that works more
>>>>>>> efficiently.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Regardless, the law passed by Congress did not differentiate "machine
>>>>>>> gun" from other guns by how fast it shoots, so the rate of fire is
>>>>>>> actually irrelevant to the issue.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Yes, we've already established that a determined judiciary can do an
>>>>>> end-run around even the clearest legislative intent.
>>>>>
>>>>> They didn't end-run anything. They only reiterated-- since our
>>>>> government seems to have lost its way and needs a reminder-- that
>>>>> Congress is the only body granted the authority by the Constitution to
>>>>> legislate in this country, not administrative agencies like BATF, and if
>>>>> Congress wants to change the definition of "machine gun" to incorporate
>>>>> bump stocks into it, it can do so at any time. However, BATF has no
>>>>> authority to do it for them.
>>>>
>>>> Machine gun:
>>>>
>>>>       "...any weapon which shoots, is designed to shoot, or can be readily
>>>> restored to shoot, automatically more than one shot, without manual
>>>> reloading, by a single function of the trigger."
>>>>
>>>> Now, tell me again how either gun in my video doesn't qualify...
>>>
>>> Because with the bump stock, it's only firing one shot per pull of the
>>> trigger. The trigger is just being pulled repeatedly really fast as a
>>> result of rebounding recoil caused by the bump stock. The bumper rocks
>>> the rifle back and forth against the shooter's trigger finger, causing a
>>> separate trigger pull each time. The statute you quoted above clearly
>>> says "by a SINGLE function of the trigger". If you shoot 100 rounds with
>>> a bump stock, you've got 100 functions of the trigger, not a single
>>> function of the trigger.
>>>
>>> Now you tell me, if bump stocks meet the definition of "machine gun" as
>>> written in the statute, why did the BATF feel the need to rewrite the
>>> statute to include them? BATF is on record when bump stocks first became
>>> popular with a determination that a bump stock-equipped rifle does NOT
>>> meet the definition of "machine gun" under the Act. It was only after
>>> the Las Vegas shooting that the BATF-- under political pressure--
>>> decided to promulgate rules that added totally new criteria to the
>>> definition of "machine gun" not found in the actual statute. This is
>>> what got them a spanking by SCOTUS.
>>>
>>> https://babylonbee.com/new/all-bump-stocks-lost-in-boating-accidents-back
>>> -in-2017-miraculously-wash-up-on-shore
>>>
========== REMAINDER OF ARTICLE TRUNCATED ==========