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From: Jeroen Belleman <jeroen@nospam.please>
Newsgroups: sci.electronics.design
Subject: Re: Expedition to Europa
Date: Sat, 29 Jun 2024 20:25:03 +0200
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On 6/29/24 19:11, Don Y wrote:
> On 6/29/2024 8:35 AM, Joe Gwinn wrote:
>> On Sat, 29 Jun 2024 04:04:11 -0700, Don Y
>> <blockedofcourse@foo.invalid> wrote:
>>
>>> On 6/28/2024 10:08 PM, bitrex wrote:
>>>> On 6/27/2024 5:17 PM, Don Y wrote:
>>>>
>>>>>> Most big librarys carry AW.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> .<https://europa.nasa.gov/mission/about/>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> If it turns out that there is life in the ocean of Europa, which has
>>>>>> existed for something like four billion years, it supports the 
>>>>>> general
>>>>>> idea of "random but inevitable" theories of Abiogenesis.
>>>>>
>>>>> _Remembrance of Earth's Past_ has an interesting take on the whole
>>>>> notion behind an "empty" universe.  It's a tedious read (mainly for
>>>>> me coming from a non-chinese culture... just keeping track of the
>>>>> characters is difficult) but has some good ideas to chew on at its 
>>>>> core.
>>>>
>>>> My guess: The Universe is mammoth, the technological and energy 
>>>> requirements of
>>>> even short-distance interstellar travel are immense, the lifespan of
>>>> technological civilizations is highly time-limited before such a 
>>>> civilization
>>>> destroys itself, technological civilizations are very rare to begin 
>>>> with, and
>>>> no technological civilization ever survives long enough to attempt it.
>>>
>>> That wouldn't explain why there are no *signs* of intelligent life.
>>>
>>> *We* can't (yet) travel interstellar distances in single lifetimes
>>> but I'm sure anyone with technology comparable to ours would be able to
>>> *detect* our presence (given that we seem to make no attempt at 
>>> "hiding")
>>>
>>> _If the Universe Is Teeming with Aliens ... WHERE IS EVERYBODY?_ 
>>> gives some
>>> interesting takes on the Fermi paradox.
>>
>> That's a bit self-important.
>>
>> If the universe is teaming with life, but alien civilizations capable
>> of interstellar travel are exceedingly rare, there would be little
>> reason for those spacefaring aliens to visit any but the other
>> advanced alien civilizations.
>>
>> We might get the equivalent of an anthropologist ever few million
>> year, and they would do whatever needed to prevent detection by that
>> which they study.
> 
> Why does an alien race have to VISIT in order to EXIST?
> 
> *We* can't visit anything beyond lunar orbit (perhaps Mars, soon)
> yet we expend considerable effort "looking".
> 
> What techniques have our deep space probes used /to prevent detection/?
> 
> 

I think we aren't nearly as conspicuous as you think we are. The
deep space probes are tiny. There is not the slightest chance of
finding them without knowing exactly where to look. The very
presence of earth itself is barely noticeable beyond a few
lightyears.

Jeroen Belleman