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From: Jeff Layman <Jeff@invalid.invalid>
Newsgroups: comp.mobile.android
Subject: Re: where are incoming text photographs stored?
Date: Sat, 29 Jun 2024 22:01:58 +0100
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On 28/06/2024 20:25, Andrew wrote:
> Jeff Layman wrote on Fri, 28 Jun 2024 19:19:15 +0100 :
> 
>> I used your favourite app manager to get information about where Google
>> puts its messages and any "attachments". It told me the messaging app
>> was com.google.android.apps.messaging, and the data directory was:
>> /data/user/0/com.google.android.apps.messaging
>>
>> I tried accessing that with Total Commander, but it was not possible.
>> Total Commander referred me to
>> <https://www.ghisler.com/androidspecialfolders.htm>. This states:
>>
>> "Accessing the special folders Android/data and Android/obb
>>
>> Google has recently restricted access to the folders Android/data and
>> Android/obb to the following two methods:
>>
>>       The built-in "Files" app
>>       A connected PC or Mac (via USB)
>>
>> Access for other apps like Total Commander has been blocked. This was
>> done by an update of the "Files" app via Play Store.
>>
>> On Android 13 and older, you can get back access to these folders by
>> uninstalling all updates of the "Files" app. On Android 14, the newer,
>> restricted version of the "Files" app is built into the operating system
>> and cannot be uninstalled.
>>
>> To uninstall the updates of the "Files" app, follow these steps:
>>
>>       Click OK in the Total Commander dialog which warned you about the
>> blocked access to launch the "Files" app
>>       Open the list of all running apps (task manager, e.g. by slowly
>> sweeping up from the bottom of the screen)
>>       Click on the icon above the "Files" app
>>       Choose "Info" or "App-Info" or click on the "i" icon (depends on
>> Android version)
>>       In the app information, click on the 3 dots in the top right corner
>>       Click on "Uninstall updates"
>>
>> Android will automatically update the "Files" app again, but you will
>> not lose access to folders after granting it once."
>>
>> I'm on Android 13 (MIUI 14.0.5), but I'm not going to do the updates
>> uninstall or use the USB to PC connection. Micky can try it if he wants.
> 
> Hi Jeff,
> 
> We've met before and you've taught me good stuff, which I appreciate.
> Everything you said I (think I) fully understand, so please don't think I'm
> chastising you - I'm just explaining what you did was right but your
> conclusion wasn't correct - as far as I know anyway.
> 
> Andy & Arno (among others) will know this stuff better than I do, but to
> help you understand why that data directory did not work for you, please
> look at these composite images I just made for you by way of example:
>   <https://i.postimg.cc/bvWQHZLx/pulsesms06.jpg>
>   <https://i.postimg.cc/rpQ1dhRP/pulsesms07.jpg>
>   <https://i.postimg.cc/QtDM3sML/pulsesms08.jpg>
> 
> However, I appreciate you are smart enough to use the Muntashirakon App
> Manager to find the location that the app stores its "data". I'm not quite
> sure if that's the same thing as where the app stores its messages though.
> I think they're different.
> 
> However, I'm not chastising you as I commend you for LOOKING where your
> messenger app stores "stuff". I think there may be different kinds of data.
> 
> a. Data specific to the app (e.g., app settings data)
> b. Data that is commonly shared with others (e.g., incoming saved media)
> 
> To test that hypothesis, I used the Muntashirakon App Manager to look at
> what it says for data for PulseSMS xyz.klinker.messenger Version 5.4.6.2816
> (2816) - which is a version before Maple Media bought the open-source app.
> 
> Muntashirakon App Manager said the PulseSMS directories are the following:
>   Data Directory: /data/user/0/xyz.klinker.messenger
>   Device-protected Data Directory: /data/user_de/0/xyz.klinker.messenger
> 
> Notice that this is NOT the directory where Pulse stores its MMS media:
>    /storage/emulated/0/Pictures/Pulse/.
> 
> What this tells me is that if an app has "all files" access, it can store
> the data anywhere it wants to (that you give it permission for).
> 
> Notice also that some file managers can't even see /data/user/0/ so that's
> why you see a plethora of the best file managers on my Android (as I've
> tested all the free file managers long ago and settled on those few).
> 
> ZArchiver for sure can see /data/user/0 but it can't go deeper on my
> unrootable Android phone (and likely it's the same on your phone also).
>   <https://play.google.com/store/apps/details?id=ru.zdevs.zarchiver>
> 
> This alone explains all the results you found, but not your conclusions.
> 
> Hope you take this in a good (constructive) light as I want to some trouble
> to document (which takes longer than anything else) the statements I made.

No problem! You've gone into quite some detail and the screenshots make 
it clear what you've done. I should say, though, that I thought I hadn't 
come to any conclusion - I'd simply reported what Muntashirakon App 
Manager (I'll now refer to this as MAM) and Total Commander had found.

I've tried to do a bit more investigating, and despite perhaps not 
knowing exactly what's going on (no surprise there - android can be 
pretty opaque at times) I've a few comments.

Firstly, there might be some differences in using PulseSMS and using the 
built-in Google message app, simply because the first is a downloaded 
app and the second is a system app. The directories used and access 
limitations seem to be the same, though (see next paragraph). There 
might also be differences in how "stock" android and the Xiaomi version 
behave. The "Files" app mentioned in the Ghisler Total Commander webpage 
is the Google one, but MAM informs me that "Files" on my phone is a 
Xiaomi app. However, when Total Commander tells me it can't access the 
/data/user/0/ directory, it offers access via the Files app. If I allow 
that, the Files app (I assume the Xiaomi one) says there is nothing in 
that directory! I guess this accords with your comment about PulseSMS 
using /storage/emulated/0/Pictures/Pulse/. Unfortunately, if I look at 
/storage/emulated/0/Pictures/Messages/ it is empty, and I know that at 
least one picture sent with a message some time ago should be there if 
that's where Messages stores its "attached" pictures. I still haven't 
found where that picture is stored.

I must say that I get very confused about message apps storage. MAM 
informs me there are two apps with "message" in the name. The first is 
simply called "Messages" (com.google.android.apps.messaging). The Data 
Directory and Device-protected Data Directory are as you found above - 
/data/user/0/ and /data/user-de/0/. The second is Phone and Messaging 
Storage (com.android.providers.telephony). This uses the same Data 
Directory and Device-protected Data Directory as mentioned above. 
According to MAM, Data usage for both of these apps is 0B! Yet I have 
quite a few messages stored, one with a picture. So why is the data 
usage 0B? It's even more confusing because "Settings" | Message App info 
tells me that Storage is 0B, but data usage for the Message app is 
27.7MB! For the Phone and Messaging Storage app both Storage and Data 
usage are 0B.

Both "Messages" and "Phone and Messaging Storage" have a permission set 
for "SMS", so are both used when SMS are sent/received?

Just one final point. MAM finds no app with "sms" in the name, but 
searching for "mms" it finds MmsService (com.android.mms.service). This 
app also shows as having 0B for Storage and Data usage, and the only 
permission allowed is SMS. I thought that an attached picture would use 
MMS. Is that not correct?

Hope this reply makes some sense... :-)

-- 
Jeff