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From: Don Y <blockedofcourse@foo.invalid>
Newsgroups: sci.electronics.design
Subject: Re: Expedition to Europa
Date: Sat, 29 Jun 2024 14:20:11 -0700
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On 6/29/2024 11:25 AM, Jeroen Belleman wrote:
> On 6/29/24 19:11, Don Y wrote:
>> On 6/29/2024 8:35 AM, Joe Gwinn wrote:
>>> On Sat, 29 Jun 2024 04:04:11 -0700, Don Y
>>> <blockedofcourse@foo.invalid> wrote:
>>>
>>>> On 6/28/2024 10:08 PM, bitrex wrote:
>>>>> On 6/27/2024 5:17 PM, Don Y wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>>> Most big librarys carry AW.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> .<https://europa.nasa.gov/mission/about/>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> If it turns out that there is life in the ocean of Europa, which has
>>>>>>> existed for something like four billion years, it supports the general
>>>>>>> idea of "random but inevitable" theories of Abiogenesis.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> _Remembrance of Earth's Past_ has an interesting take on the whole
>>>>>> notion behind an "empty" universe.  It's a tedious read (mainly for
>>>>>> me coming from a non-chinese culture... just keeping track of the
>>>>>> characters is difficult) but has some good ideas to chew on at its core.
>>>>>
>>>>> My guess: The Universe is mammoth, the technological and energy 
>>>>> requirements of
>>>>> even short-distance interstellar travel are immense, the lifespan of
>>>>> technological civilizations is highly time-limited before such a civilization
>>>>> destroys itself, technological civilizations are very rare to begin with, and
>>>>> no technological civilization ever survives long enough to attempt it.
>>>>
>>>> That wouldn't explain why there are no *signs* of intelligent life.
>>>>
>>>> *We* can't (yet) travel interstellar distances in single lifetimes
>>>> but I'm sure anyone with technology comparable to ours would be able to
>>>> *detect* our presence (given that we seem to make no attempt at "hiding")
>>>>
>>>> _If the Universe Is Teeming with Aliens ... WHERE IS EVERYBODY?_ gives some
>>>> interesting takes on the Fermi paradox.
>>>
>>> That's a bit self-important.
>>>
>>> If the universe is teaming with life, but alien civilizations capable
>>> of interstellar travel are exceedingly rare, there would be little
>>> reason for those spacefaring aliens to visit any but the other
>>> advanced alien civilizations.
>>>
>>> We might get the equivalent of an anthropologist ever few million
>>> year, and they would do whatever needed to prevent detection by that
>>> which they study.
>>
>> Why does an alien race have to VISIT in order to EXIST?
>>
>> *We* can't visit anything beyond lunar orbit (perhaps Mars, soon)
>> yet we expend considerable effort "looking".
>>
>> What techniques have our deep space probes used /to prevent detection/?
> 
> I think we aren't nearly as conspicuous as you think we are. The
> deep space probes are tiny. There is not the slightest chance of
> finding them without knowing exactly where to look. The very
> presence of earth itself is barely noticeable beyond a few
> lightyears.

Yet *we* look.  Do we imagine other life forms will be MORE conspicuous?