Path: ...!eternal-september.org!feeder3.eternal-september.org!news.eternal-september.org!.POSTED!not-for-mail
From: moviePig <nobody@nowhere.com>
Newsgroups: rec.arts.tv
Subject: Re: Snopes Finally Debunks Left-Wing Claim of "Very Fine People" in
 Charlottesville
Date: Sun, 30 Jun 2024 17:12:53 -0400
Organization: A noiseless patient Spider
Lines: 99
Message-ID: <v5shol$mhl9$1@dont-email.me>
References: <eRicnR36Ss1EluL7nZ2dnZfqnPidnZ2d@giganews.com>
 <v5n3i8$3fp7d$2@dont-email.me> <p89u7jp61lh9r79gnljm2cqip3qrq5k7qs@4ax.com>
 <v5nd2o$3ho0r$1@dont-email.me> <fxWfO.43481$Gurd.17458@fx34.iad>
 <v5pem2$rk0$1@dont-email.me> <v5pffp$rk0$3@dont-email.me>
 <17ddc2e97a47e23a$169216$916931$50d51a61@news.newsdemon.com>
 <v5s15b$jil7$1@dont-email.me>
 <17dde2497ab63c19$847$1235238$4cd50660@news.newsdemon.com>
Reply-To: nobody@nowhere.com
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8; format=flowed
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit
Injection-Date: Sun, 30 Jun 2024 23:12:54 +0200 (CEST)
Injection-Info: dont-email.me; posting-host="99490fd70b14ed72be333c699e21268b";
	logging-data="738985"; mail-complaints-to="abuse@eternal-september.org";	posting-account="U2FsdGVkX1+4Szmj/u52dGY2vHQKqYLVZd3FYLoxjEA="
User-Agent: Mozilla Thunderbird
Cancel-Lock: sha1:DJSHTI+khC0l2ohsn9SUJXi6ebs=
In-Reply-To: <17dde2497ab63c19$847$1235238$4cd50660@news.newsdemon.com>
Content-Language: en-US
Bytes: 5544

On 6/30/2024 4:30 PM, trotsky wrote:
> On 6/30/24 11:29 AM, moviePig wrote:
>> On 6/30/2024 6:55 AM, trotsky wrote:
>>> On 6/29/24 12:15 PM, moviePig wrote:
>>>> On 6/29/2024 1:01 PM, moviePig wrote:
>>>>> On 6/29/2024 12:22 PM, trotsky wrote:
>>>>>> On 6/28/24 5:22 PM, moviePig wrote:
>>>>>>> On 6/28/2024 5:10 PM, shawn wrote:
>>>>>>>> On Fri, 28 Jun 2024 19:39:52 -0000 (UTC), "Adam H. Kerman"
>>>>>>>> <ahk@chinet.com> wrote:
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> BTR1701 <atropos@mac.com> wrote:
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> It's seven years after the fact and the damage has long since 
>>>>>>>>>> been done, but
>>>>>>>>>> the left-wing fact checkers at Snopes have finally come out 
>>>>>>>>>> and admitted the
>>>>>>>>>> whole claim that Trump called neo-Nazis "very fine people" was 
>>>>>>>>>> a hoax. I have
>>>>>>>>>> no idea why, but credit where it's due, I suppose?
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> https://www.snopes.com/fact-check/trump-very-fine-people/
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> Eh
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> It's another example of the more Trump talked, the more he buried
>>>>>>>>> himself. There was no way for him to win. He should have 
>>>>>>>>> ignored it, or
>>>>>>>>> limited his comments to condemning the murder.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> I don't put the "let's go beat up Nazis" counterprotestors on a 
>>>>>>>>> high
>>>>>>>>> moral plane. As far as I could tell, the protestors on both 
>>>>>>>>> sides had
>>>>>>>>> pretty low morals.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> I've personally objected to the removal of Civil War monuments 
>>>>>>>>> making
>>>>>>>>> the generals god-like, but MY reason is rather different than the
>>>>>>>>> neo-Nazis: I don't think the modern generation should be 
>>>>>>>>> re-writing
>>>>>>>>> history. A past generation erected those monuments and we need 
>>>>>>>>> to look
>>>>>>>>> the ugliness of American history square in the face so we never 
>>>>>>>>> forget
>>>>>>>>> that Civil War generals were honored by certain Americans for 
>>>>>>>>> the modern
>>>>>>>>> politics of that era.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> People are worried about those statues glorifying the actions of 
>>>>>>>> those
>>>>>>>> people. I don't think the reasons behind the erecting of the 
>>>>>>>> statues
>>>>>>>> or the timing is brought up that often. Certainly I never knew 
>>>>>>>> growing
>>>>>>>> up the time frame for the erecting of the statues or the actual
>>>>>>>> reasons behind it. It would be better to have kept the statues 
>>>>>>>> and put
>>>>>>>> more effort into teaching the history behind their erection.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Not that I think it would change things as it seems most people 
>>>>>>>> forget
>>>>>>>> what little bit of history they get taught in school not long after
>>>>>>>> leaving school.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> I despite prettying up history. Trump was still wrong.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Agreed. History is full of ugly moments that are best remembered in
>>>>>>>> the hopes that we don't repeat them.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> A descriptive plaque with any such statue would seem to be so 
>>>>>>> obvious a solution that you have to wonder if both sides 
>>>>>>> vehemently oppose it.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> We don't need statues to learn history.
>>>>>
>>>>> In fact, these statues seem to be about forgetting it...
>>>>
>>>> Also: my point is that, even if Trump had said verbatim "Nazis are 
>>>> fine people", it'd be defensible as a (non-Freudian) slip of the 
>>>> tongue ...because Trump simply isn't suicidal.  And, trying to 
>>>> indict him on such weak claims only undercuts the many strong ones.
>>>
>>> None of what you said has anything to do with the facts in evidence.
>>
>> The fact is that even if there were a video of Trump saying "Nazis are 
>> fine people" (which, afaik, there isn't) it would beggar plausibility.
> 
> 
> He said there are fine people on both sides.  Why don't you get what the 
> discussion is about?

Yes, but the two sides weren't "Nazis" and "non-Nazis".  (Yes, I know 
that all the Nazis were on only one of the sides.)