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From: olcott <polcott333@gmail.com>
Newsgroups: comp.theory
Subject: Re: People are still trying to get away with disagreeing with the
 semantics of the x86 language
Date: Thu, 4 Jul 2024 08:41:22 -0500
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On 7/4/2024 8:26 AM, joes wrote:
> Am Thu, 04 Jul 2024 07:46:15 -0500 schrieb olcott:
>> On 7/4/2024 5:15 AM, joes wrote:
>>> Am Wed, 03 Jul 2024 09:45:57 -0500 schrieb olcott:
>>>> On 7/3/2024 9:39 AM, joes wrote:
>>>>> Am Wed, 03 Jul 2024 08:21:40 -0500 schrieb olcott:
>>>>>> On 7/3/2024 3:26 AM, Fred. Zwarts wrote:
>>>>>>> Op 02.jul.2024 om 21:48 schreef olcott:
>>>>>>>> On 7/2/2024 2:22 PM, Fred. Zwarts wrote:
>>>>>>>>> Op 02.jul.2024 om 20:43 schreef olcott:
>>>>>>>>>> On 7/2/2024 1:59 AM, Mikko wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>> On 2024-07-01 12:44:57 +0000, olcott said:
>>>>>>>>>>>> On 7/1/2024 1:05 AM, Mikko wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>>>> On 2024-06-30 17:18:09 +0000, olcott said:
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Richard just said that he affirms that when DDD correctly
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> simulated by HHH calls HHH(DDD) that this call returns even
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> though the semantics of the x86 language disagrees.
>>>>> Which semantics?
>>> I repeat.
> What x86 semantics say that HHH can’t return?
> 
>>>>>> DDD correctly emulated by HHH calls an emulated HHH(DDD) that
>>>>>> emulates DDD that calls an emulated HHH(DDD)
>>>>>> in a cycle that cannot end unless aborted.
>>>>> But HHH aborts, so the cycle does end.
>>>> As long as it is impossible for DDD correctly emulated by HHH to reach
>>>> its own ret instruction then DDD never halts even when its stops
>>>> running because its emulation was aborted.
>>> HHH halts by definition. Why can’t DDD?
>> By definition DDD calls its simulator.
> Yes, and nothing else. So when HHH returns, so does DDD.
> 

You simply lack sufficient technical competence of these things
*Machine address 00002174 of DDD is never reached*
I am using an x86 emulator with decades of development effort.

_DDD()
[00002163] 55         push ebp
[00002164] 8bec       mov ebp,esp
[00002166] 6863210000 push 00002163 ; push DDD
[0000216b] e853f4ffff call 000015c3 ; call HHH(DDD)
[00002170] 83c404     add esp,+04
[00002173] 5d         pop ebp
[00002174] c3         ret
Size in bytes:(0018) [00002174]

_main()
[00002183] 55         push ebp
[00002184] 8bec       mov ebp,esp
[00002186] 6863210000 push 00002163
[0000218b] e833f4ffff call 000015c3
[00002190] 83c404     add esp,+04
[00002193] 33c0       xor eax,eax
[00002195] 5d         pop ebp
[00002196] c3         ret
Size in bytes:(0020) [00002196]

  machine   stack     stack     machine    assembly
  address   address   data      code       language
  ========  ========  ========  =========  =============
[00002183][001037dd][00000000] 55         push ebp
[00002184][001037dd][00000000] 8bec       mov ebp,esp
[00002186][001037d9][00002163] 6863210000 push 00002163
[0000218b][001037d5][00002190] e833f4ffff call 000015c3
New slave_stack at:103881 ; *create a different process context*
Begin Local Halt Decider Simulation   Execution Trace Stored at:113889
[00002163][00113879][0011387d] 55         push ebp
[00002164][00113879][0011387d] 8bec       mov ebp,esp
[00002166][00113875][00002163] 6863210000 push 00002163 ; push DDD
[0000216b][00113871][00002170] e853f4ffff call 000015c3 ; call HHH(DDD)
New slave_stack at:14e2a9 ; *create a different process context*
[00002163][0015e2a1][0015e2a5] 55         push ebp
[00002164][0015e2a1][0015e2a5] 8bec       mov ebp,esp
[00002166][0015e29d][00002163] 6863210000 push 00002163 ; push DDD
[0000216b][0015e299][00002170] e853f4ffff call 000015c3 ; call HHH(DDD)
Local Halt Decider: Infinite Recursion Detected Simulation Stopped

[00002190][001037dd][00000000] 83c404     add esp,+04
[00002193][001037dd][00000000] 33c0       xor eax,eax
[00002195][001037e1][00000018] 5d         pop ebp
[00002196][001037e5][00000000] c3         ret
Number of Instructions Executed(10066) == 150 Pages


-- 
Copyright 2024 Olcott "Talent hits a target no one else can hit; Genius
hits a target no one else can see." Arthur Schopenhauer