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From: olcott <polcott333@gmail.com>
Newsgroups: comp.theory
Subject: Re: This function proves that only the outermost HHH examines the
 execution trace
Date: Sun, 28 Jul 2024 18:54:54 -0500
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On 7/28/2024 4:23 AM, Mikko wrote:
> On 2024-07-27 18:20:19 +0000, olcott said:
> 
>> On 7/27/2024 1:14 PM, Alan Mackenzie wrote:
>>> olcott <polcott333@gmail.com> wrote:
>>>
>>>> Stopping running is not the same as halting.
>>>> DDD emulated by HHH stops running when its emulation has been aborted.
>>>> This is not the same as reaching its ret instruction and terminating
>>>> normally (AKA halting).
>>>
>>> I think you're wrong, here.  All your C programs are a stand in for
>>> turing machines.  A turing machine is either running or halted.  
>>> There is
>>> no third state "aborted".
>>
>> Until you take the conventional ideas of
>> (a) UTM
>> (b) TM Description
>> (c) Decider
>> and combine them together to become a simulating partial halt decider.
> 
> You also need the conventional ideas of halting and halt decider.
> The latter is largely a combination of the conventional ideas of
> decider and halting but also involves the conventional of
> prediction, so you need that, too.
> 
> Although the conventional idea of testing is not 
> relevant to the construction of a simulating partial 
> halt decider it is helpful to presentation of the
> result, especially if your target audience contains 
> software engineers. If your target audience is mainly 
> mathematicians the convnetional idea of proofs is more 
> useful because in that case most of your presentation 
> must be proofs.
> 

My ideas must be anchored in fully specified running software
otherwise the false assumptions made by computer science people
remain hidden.

Even when I slap them in the face with proven facts they deny
these proven facts on the basis of their indoctrination.

Even Mike is trying to get away with saying that DDD correctly
emulated by HHH according to the semantics specified by the
machine code of DDD and the machine code of HHH when DDD calls
HHH(DDD) in recursive emulation is incorrectly emulated.

HHH(DDD) has the exact same pattern as Infinite_Recursion()
where there are no conditional branch instructions that would
prevent the first three instructions of Infinite_Recursion()
from endlessly repeating.

void Infinite_Recursion()
{
   Infinite_Recursion();
}

_Infinite_Recursion()
[0000215a] 55         push ebp      ; 1st line
[0000215b] 8bec       mov ebp,esp   ; 2nd line
[0000215d] e8f8ffffff call 0000215a ; 3rd line
[00002162] 5d         pop ebp
[00002163] c3         ret
Size in bytes:(0010) [00002163]

Begin Local Halt Decider Simulation   Execution Trace Stored at:113934
[0000215a][00113924][00113928] 55         push ebp      ; 1st line
[0000215b][00113924][00113928] 8bec       mov ebp,esp   ; 2nd line
[0000215d][00113920][00002162] e8f8ffffff call 0000215a ; 3rd line
[0000215a][0011391c][00113924] 55         push ebp      ; 1st line
[0000215b][0011391c][00113924] 8bec       mov ebp,esp   ; 2nd line
[0000215d][00113918][00002162] e8f8ffffff call 0000215a ; 3rd line
Local Halt Decider: Infinite Recursion Detected Simulation Stopped

=====

void DDD()
{
   HHH(DDD);
}

_DDD()
[00002177] 55               push ebp      ; 1st line
[00002178] 8bec             mov ebp,esp   ; 2nd line
[0000217a] 6877210000       push 00002177 ; push DDD
[0000217f] e853f4ffff       call 000015d7 ; call HHH
[00002184] 83c404           add esp,+04
[00002187] 5d               pop ebp
[00002188] c3               ret
Size in bytes:(0018) [00002188]

// executed HHH emulates 1st instance of DDD
New slave_stack at:10388d
Begin Local Halt Decider Simulation   Execution Trace Stored at:113895
[00002177][00113885][00113889] 55         push ebp      ; 1st line
[00002178][00113885][00113889] 8bec       mov ebp,esp   ; 2nd line
[0000217a][00113881][00002177] 6877210000 push 00002177 ; push DDD
[0000217f][0011387d][00002184] e853f4ffff call 000015d7 ; call HHH

// emulated HHH emulates 2nd instance of DDD
New slave_stack at:14e2b5
[00002177][0015e2ad][0015e2b1] 55         push ebp      ; 1st line
[00002178][0015e2ad][0015e2b1] 8bec       mov ebp,esp   ; 2nd line
[0000217a][0015e2a9][00002177] 6877210000 push 00002177 ; push DDD
[0000217f][0015e2a5][00002184] e853f4ffff call 000015d7 ; call HHH
Local Halt Decider: Infinite Recursion Detected Simulation Stopped

-- 
Copyright 2024 Olcott "Talent hits a target no one else can hit; Genius
hits a target no one else can see." Arthur Schopenhauer