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Path: ...!eternal-september.org!feeder3.eternal-september.org!news.eternal-september.org!.POSTED!not-for-mail From: olcott <polcott333@gmail.com> Newsgroups: comp.theory Subject: Re: Pathological self-reference changes the semantics of the same finite string. Date: Fri, 30 Aug 2024 07:57:49 -0500 Organization: A noiseless patient Spider Lines: 62 Message-ID: <vasfkd$ftut$2@dont-email.me> References: <va104l$376ed$4@dont-email.me> <va38qh$3ia79$1@dont-email.me> <7a1c569a699e79bfa146affbbae3eac7b91cd263@i2pn2.org> <va3f7o$3ipp3$1@dont-email.me> <729cc551062c13875686d266a5453a488058e81c@i2pn2.org> <va3kac$3nd5c$1@dont-email.me> <148bf4dd91f32379a6d81a621fb7ec3fc1e00db0@i2pn2.org> <va3lai$3nd5c$2@dont-email.me> <va46sd$3pr24$1@dont-email.me> <va4mle$3s0hu$1@dont-email.me> <5591ff08ed8f7b4bdf33813681e156b775efe0ec@i2pn2.org> <va63uu$2fo9$1@dont-email.me> <b0a86b6a1343ebb5f9112ae757768a7cbbc770b2@i2pn2.org> <va65r8$6ht7$1@dont-email.me> <da75188ffa7677bd2b6979c8fc6ba82119404306@i2pn2.org> <878qwn0wyz.fsf@bsb.me.uk> <efacnfsQdv-ErlT7nZ2dnZfqnPadnZ2d@brightview.co.uk> <87le0jzc8f.fsf_-_@bsb.me.uk> <vaj1kd$2kvg9$1@dont-email.me> <vamk31$3d76g$1@dont-email.me> <van30n$3f6c0$2@dont-email.me> <vap90d$3t06p$1@dont-email.me> <vaptvg$3vumk$2@dont-email.me> <vaqbo3$22im$2@dont-email.me> <vaqcj8$28ni$3@dont-email.me> <varus8$dqgo$1@dont-email.me> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Injection-Date: Fri, 30 Aug 2024 14:57:49 +0200 (CEST) Injection-Info: dont-email.me; posting-host="0bcb2e8a964ef5ab37c2a5858ba7d4a2"; logging-data="522205"; mail-complaints-to="abuse@eternal-september.org"; posting-account="U2FsdGVkX19RrWn1Lze1Gi0f89fsY8Sn" User-Agent: Mozilla Thunderbird Cancel-Lock: sha1:G8Og1/T5J+wx/zsGdcrZjvgSLsI= In-Reply-To: <varus8$dqgo$1@dont-email.me> Content-Language: en-US Bytes: 4454 On 8/30/2024 3:11 AM, Mikko wrote: > On 2024-08-29 17:53:44 +0000, olcott said: > >> I just proved that the basic notion of finite strings >> having unique meanings independently of their context >> is incorrect. > > The context is the halting problem. The behavior of the directly executed DDD and executed HHH is different from the behavior of the emulated DDD and the emulated HHH and all four of them are emulated by the world class x86 emulator libx86emu It is easy to see that when the executed HHH emulates DDD that it does this correctly when we look at the execution trace and see the the first four instructions of DDD are listed. _DDD() [00002172] 55 push ebp ; housekeeping [00002173] 8bec mov ebp,esp ; housekeeping [00002175] 6872210000 push 00002172 ; push DDD [0000217a] e853f4ffff call 000015d2 ; call HHH(DDD) [0000217f] 83c404 add esp,+04 [00002182] 5d pop ebp [00002183] c3 ret Size in bytes:(0018) [00002183] New slave_stack at:1038c4 Begin Local Halt Decider Simulation Execution Trace Stored at:1138cc [00002172][001138bc][001138c0] 55 push ebp ; housekeeping [00002173][001138bc][001138c0] 8bec mov ebp,esp ; housekeeping [00002175][001138b8][00002172] 6872210000 push 00002172 ; push DDD [0000217a][001138b4][0000217f] e853f4ffff call 000015d2 ; call HHH(DDD) New slave_stack at:14e2ec [00002172][0015e2e4][0015e2e8] 55 push ebp ; housekeeping [00002173][0015e2e4][0015e2e8] 8bec mov ebp,esp ; housekeeping [00002175][0015e2e0][00002172] 6872210000 push 00002172 ; push DDD [0000217a][0015e2dc][0000217f] e853f4ffff call 000015d2 ; call HHH(DDD) Local Halt Decider: Infinite Recursion Detected Simulation Stopped Then this emulated DDD calls an emulated HHH(DDD). It is easy to see that when the executed HHH emulates itself emulated DDD that it does this correctly when we look at the execution trace and see the the first four instructions of DDD are listed again. > It specifies the meanings > but not any finite strings to carry these meanings. The meanings > exist independently of any finite string. A solution or a partial > solution to the problem specifies how each of these meanings shall > be expressed with a finite string for other parts of the solution. > -- Copyright 2024 Olcott "Talent hits a target no one else can hit; Genius hits a target no one else can see." Arthur Schopenhauer