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From: Tom Elam <thomas.e.elam@gmail.com>
Newsgroups: comp.sys.mac.advocacy
Subject: Re: The trip to France, Germany and Switzerland
Date: Sat, 31 Aug 2024 17:13:53 -0400
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On 8/30/2024 9:38 AM, -hh wrote:
> On 8/30/24 9:15 AM, Tom Elam wrote:
>> To sum it up, fun but not as much as we thought it might be.
> 
> 
> That happens.  On our own last trans-Atlantic outing, we both caught 
> some sort of not-CoVid bug around ten days in, which was unpleasant.
> 
> 
> 
>> Arriving Paris on time we elected to take a taxi to the hotel. Given 
>> it was 4 of us the taxi was not that much more than the train/Metro 
>> and a lot less hassle. The hotel transfer was on us as we arrived 
>> several days before the Viking tour started.
> 
> 
> Price break on four makes it worth doing AFAIC, even before considering 
> your later comment about your travel companion's lower physical shape.
> 
> 
>> Took our friends to see some museums, the tower level 3, other spots, 
>> and had some incredible meals. However, the friends are not in the 
>> best physical shape and that limited our options. We traveled by 
>> Metro, Uber, taxi and RATP. They were fascinated by the Notre Dame 
>> crypt, Montmarte and Musee D'Orsay.
> 
> 
> I've really enjoyed the Orsay; its also a nice place to plan taking a 
> lunch break, in the cafe that's "inside" of the clock face.
> 
> 
>> The tower experience was slightly compromised by rain and poor 
>> visibility, but at that point we had no other options for another day. 
>> The just-concluded Olympic games had a few streets closed and the 
>> Champ de Mars still occupied by venues and blocked off.
>>
>> Leaving Paris by Viking bus via the Luxembourg American cemetery we 
>> arrived the Viking ship at Trier. Spent a week+ on board, visited some 
>> Moselle/Rhine River towns in Germany and France. A WWII buff, I was 
>> amazed the the Allies ever made it across the part of Moselle valley 
>> we saw.
> 
> I learned awhile back that my father did one of those Mosel crossings, 
> somewhat proximate to the town of Zell, if I recall correctly.  I 
> understand that the river looks somewhat different today, as the dam 
> system for ship navigation has changed over the decades (less current; 
> possibly slightly higher average water levels too).
> 
> 
> 
>> Viking's U.S. marketing portrays the company's river cruises as 
>> exceptional. In our experience with prior European river cruises they 
>> are not. The ship needed some cosmetic refurb, on day 1 a "technical 
>> issue" delay caused us to miss our first stop, and the food and crew 
>> service was very good, but not great. We also had a few tour guides 
>> that did not speak great English. My wife had to assist one with 
>> translating the excellent French of a local vineyard owner.
> 
> I don't recall the details why we skipped using Viking in EU, but we've 
> had good success with Uniworld and AMA Waterways.  One trade-off for 
> comparing these two is that Uniworld had free DIY laundry onboard (helps 
> lighten the bags) but AMA had better wines & wine stewards at dinner.
> 
> 
>> On the other hand we had a medical emergency that led to an unplanned 
>> stop. It was handled well and did not cause any issues for the schedule.
>>
>> Arriving Basel we did the ship's included city tour that was very well 
>> done. That afternoon we departed for Zurich, toured that city center 
>> for a day and a half by tram with a lake boat ride thrown in, and had 
>> a great meal on the last evening. Jolly good fun.
> 
> 
> There's a traditional swiss restaurant that I'd like to get back to in 
> Zurich, IIRC, not far from the Fraümunster: a good spot for Rösti.
> 
> 
>> Had a bit of a tram experience. The hotel was a few miles west of the 
>> lake and city center. Departing the hotel on line 4 for our dinner the 
>> tram stopped after about 10 minutes and it was announced that there 
>> had been an accident ahead involving a tram and car. Line 4 was being 
>> delayed and diverted. Almost all the passengers left the tram. Two 
>> young locals offered to show us how to get to our destination. We 
>> followed their instructions and arrived via a different route with 
>> minimal delay. Could have figured that out ourselves but their 
>> assistance was very helpful.
> 
> 
> Things like that happen.  Fortunately, you weren't time-stressed such as 
> heading to the airport for a departure flight.  Have had that happen 
> with a train issue in Belgium.
> 
> 
>> Flights back through Philly were both on time. Got to experience the 
>> 787 for the first time too.
> 
> IIRC, the 787's Polaris is a bit more roomy than on their 757 version.
> 
> 
>> Next year? I'm voting for 2 weeks in southern/western France via 
>> rental car. The wife has veto power but there is a still lot we have 
>> not seen. And Hugh, I checked with National. My age is not an issue 
>> for them.
> 
> 
> Been meaning to get around to a "drive around" in FR as well: several 
> different directions though (Normandy, Mont-Saint-Miche, Bordeaux, 
> Chateaus, etc).
> 
> Plus one probably unknown to Americans sight is the city of Bourges, as 
> there's a huge cathedral there that gets compared to Notre Dame (but 
> without crowds), plus an evening walk through its old timbered houses 
> section is nice: tastefully lit.  A single overnight is adequate; figure 
> it as 3.5+hrs (175mi) drive due south of Paris.
> 
> And on the rental car, the important thing here is that the risk of age 
> restrictions is now on your checklist to verify in advance, instead of 
> getting blindsided at the last minute by it.
> 
> 
> -hh
> 

We ate in that same D'Orsey restaurant. Much nicer than the small snack 
bar on the ground floor.

I think the onboard AMA experience is every bit as good as Viking. But 
their excursions are better and the cabins a bit larger. My take is that 
Viking has become so big that with multiple ships in a port as seemed to 
happen frequently they have issues with smaller places some of the AMA 
excursions we liked. Example - the small music museum at Rudesheim. I 
also remember that the guides were better and we had more free time in port.

I just today watched a YouTube on touring France that may change my mind 
a bit about next year. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=d8RdNGT1jz8

Taking the TGV to a city then renting the car if you need it could be a 
lot of fun, even if a bit more expensive. Thoughts?

We have done 2 weeks in Normandy/Brittany and about the same in Paris 
plus 2 trips that took us to the south coast. Time to branch out. Massif 
Central, Loire Valley and Alsace are high on my list.