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From: olcott <polcott333@gmail.com>
Newsgroups: comp.theory
Subject: Re: Defining a correct halt decider
Date: Wed, 4 Sep 2024 08:59:55 -0500
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On 9/4/2024 5:17 AM, Fred. Zwarts wrote:
> Op 03.sep.2024 om 15:17 schreef olcott:
>> On 9/3/2024 3:44 AM, Mikko wrote:
>>> On 2024-09-02 16:06:11 +0000, olcott said:
>>>
>>>> A correct halt decider is a Turing machine T with one accept state 
>>>> and one reject state such that:
>>>>
>>>> If T is executed with initial tape contents equal to an encoding of 
>>>> Turing machine X and its initial tape contents Y, and execution of a 
>>>> real machine X with initial tape contents Y eventually halts, the 
>>>> execution of T eventually ends up in the accept state and then stops.
>>>>
>>>> If T is executed with initial tape contents equal to an encoding of 
>>>> Turing machine X and its initial tape contents Y, and execution of a 
>>>> real machine X with initial tape contents Y does not eventually 
>>>> halt, the execution of T eventually ends up in the reject state and 
>>>> then stops.
>>>
>>> Your "definition" fails to specify "encoding". There is no standard
>>> encoding of Turing machines and tape contents.
>>>
>>
>> That is why I made the isomorphic x86utm system.
>> By failing to have such a concrete system all kinds
>> of false assumptions cannot be refuted.
>>
>> The behavior of DDD emulated by HHH** <is> different
>> than the behavior of the directly executed DDD**
>> **according to the semantics of the x86 language
>>
>> HHH is required to report on the behavior tat its finite
>> string input specifies even when this requires HHH
>> to emulate itself emulating DDD.
>>
>> DDD never halts unless it reaches its own final
>> halt state. The fact that the executed HHH halts
>> has nothing to do with this.
>>
>> HHH is not allowed to report on the computation that
>> itself is contained within.
> 
> But it must be able to process a finite string containing a copy of 
> itself, or containing a similar algorithm.
> 
>>
>> Except for the case of pathological self-reference the
>> behavior of the directly executed machine M is always
>> the same as the correctly simulated finite string ⟨M⟩.
> 
> There is no self-reference, 

It is very stupid to say that when this proves there is
https://github.com/plolcott/x86utm/blob/master/Halt7out.txt

> except in olcott's crippled example, where 
> he places the code of the simulating HHH inside the finite string of its 
> input.
> The finite string containing the description of DDD and all functions 
> called by it including HHH) should not be placed in the same memory 
> location as the simulator's code and variables.
> 
>>
>> That no one has noticed that they can differ does not
>> create an axiom where they are not allowed to differ.
> 
> By twisting the code and the examples in such ways that the simulation 
> is crippled, you do not prove that they show anything useful.
> 
>>
>> No one noticed that they differ only because everyone
>> rejected the idea of a simulating halt decider out-of-hand
>> without review.
>>
> Olcott is a strange person. At the one hand he is begging for reviews, 
> but he is so arrogant that he does not want to learn anything from the 
> reviews. He has such a strong belief in his ideas, that he thinks that 
> reviewers are lying if the prove that he is incorrect.


-- 
Copyright 2024 Olcott "Talent hits a target no one else can hit; Genius
hits a target no one else can see." Arthur Schopenhauer