Path: ...!eternal-september.org!feeder3.eternal-september.org!news.eternal-september.org!.POSTED!not-for-mail
From: olcott <polcott333@gmail.com>
Newsgroups: sci.logic
Subject: Re: {linguistic truth} is the foundation of truth in mathematical
 logic
Date: Mon, 9 Sep 2024 08:22:24 -0500
Organization: A noiseless patient Spider
Lines: 67
Message-ID: <vbmsqg$2dpff$4@dont-email.me>
References: <vbdfk4$h64u$1@dont-email.me> <vber20$qdsh$1@dont-email.me>
 <vberl2$punj$10@dont-email.me> <vbh3ka$19upq$1@dont-email.me>
 <vbhjtn$1c7u5$3@dont-email.me>
 <791b35f72d5e8cf89944aaa6110d2140081f97d4@i2pn2.org>
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8; format=flowed
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit
Injection-Date: Mon, 09 Sep 2024 15:22:24 +0200 (CEST)
Injection-Info: dont-email.me; posting-host="3c28129a9e933e7547d426856e6a8cad";
	logging-data="2549231"; mail-complaints-to="abuse@eternal-september.org";	posting-account="U2FsdGVkX1+ylTw7Rp3efaO0U32p0xwL"
User-Agent: Mozilla Thunderbird
Cancel-Lock: sha1:kYdEKeHjEeuIdTsQ365JCLXaEfk=
In-Reply-To: <791b35f72d5e8cf89944aaa6110d2140081f97d4@i2pn2.org>
Content-Language: en-US
Bytes: 3819

On 9/7/2024 8:40 AM, Richard Damon wrote:
> On 9/7/24 9:19 AM, olcott wrote:
>> On 9/7/2024 3:41 AM, Mikko wrote:
>>> On 2024-09-06 12:13:22 +0000, olcott said:
>>>
>>>> On 9/6/2024 7:03 AM, Mikko wrote:
>>>>> On 2024-09-05 23:41:55 +0000, olcott said:
>>>>>
>>>>>> A whole body of {linguistic truth} can be defined as expressions
>>>>>> of language that are true on the basis of their meaning expressed
>>>>>> in this same language.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Expressions that can only be known to be true on the basis
>>>>>> of observation belong to a different class of knowledge.
>>>>>
>>>>> Linguistic things should be discussed in sci.lang.
>>>>> This group is for things related to logic.
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>> The actual foundation of logical and mathematical truth
>>>> is simply relations between finite strings, thus linguistic
>>>> truth.
>>>
>>> I don't think logicians want to use the word "linguistic" for anything
>>> in foundations of logic.
>>>
>>
>> I don't care. When I refer to analytic truth most everyone
>> says that has been disavowed by Quine and the conversation
>> dies right there.
>>
>> The most apt name for truth specified by relations between
>> finite strings is linguistic truth. Truth that requires sense
>> data form the sense organs become empirical truth.
>>
>> This converts the analytic/synthetic distinction into the
>> linguistic/empirical distinction so Willard Van Orman Quine
>> can STFU !
>>
> 
> The problem is that you don't seem to understand the concept of domain 
> of discussion (or context).
> 
> Quine is talking about the limitation of Natural Language to discuss 
> concepts, that BECAUSE words can have ill-defined meaning, a statement 
> in Natural Language can be ambiguous.
> 

Quine is just too freaking stupid to understand that the term "bachelor"
is an otherwise totally meaningless finite string until it is stipulated
to have the meaning of ~Married & Adult & Male.

Within my own foundation of linguistic truth this is dead obvious.
This is related to yet not identical with:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Truth-conditional_semantics

> Your seemingly important need to just try to redefine terms just shows 
> that you actually don't understand the terms that you are using.

When the meaning of terms is AFU such that the Sapir–Whorf
hypothesis makes it impossible to communicate new ideas
the incoherent existing terms must have their erroneous
ass corrected.

-- 
Copyright 2024 Olcott "Talent hits a target no one else can hit; Genius
hits a target no one else can see." Arthur Schopenhauer