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From: Cryptoengineer <petertrei@gmail.com>
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Subject: Re: Whoops! The Atlantic Makes Trump Look EPIC In Cover Intended as a
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Date: Thu, 19 Sep 2024 10:41:38 -0400
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On 9/19/2024 4:12 AM, D wrote:
> 
> 
> On Wed, 18 Sep 2024, Lynn McGuire wrote:
> 
>> On 9/18/2024 2:49 PM, D wrote:
>>>
>>>
>>> On Wed, 18 Sep 2024, Scott Lurndal wrote:
>>>
>>>> Lynn McGuire <lynnmcguire5@gmail.com> writes:
>>>>> On 9/17/2024 6:11 PM, quadibloc wrote:
>>>>>> On Mon, 16 Sep 2024 16:29:18 +0000, Don wrote:
>>>>>>
>>>>
>>>>>> Global warming is not an imaginary spectre. The science involved is
>>>>>> really basic stuff.
>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> Any Global Warming is not caused by humans so your basic thesis is
>>>>> wrong.
>>>>
>>>> You claim to be a process chemist, yet you make such
>>>> speciously _wrong_ statements.   Svante August Arrhenius proved the
>>>> effects of CO2 on the atmosphere over a century ago (and earned
>>>> a Nobel prize in Chemistry).
>>>>
>>>
>>> Why was Svante Arrhenius wrong about CO2?
>>>
>>> Introduction to Arrhenius’ Work Svante Arrhenius, a Swedish physical 
>>> chemist, is often credited with the early scientific foundation of 
>>> the greenhouse effect and global warming due to carbon dioxide (CO2). 
>>> In his 1896 publication, he posited that a doubling of atmospheric 
>>> CO2 could lead to an increase in global temperatures by approximately 
>>> 5 to 6 degrees Celsius. This assertion was based on his calculations 
>>> regarding the heat absorption properties of CO2 compared to water vapor.
>>>
>>> Overestimation of Temperature Increase One of the primary reasons 
>>> Arrhenius was considered wrong about CO2’s impact on temperature is 
>>> that he significantly overestimated the effect of a doubling of CO2 
>>> concentration. His initial calculations suggested a temperature rise 
>>> between 5 and 6°C; however, later revisions indicated that this 
>>> figure was too high. By 1906, after further analysis and feedback 
>>> from contemporaries like Knut Ångström, Arrhenius revised his 
>>> estimate downwards to around 1.2°C directly and up to 2.1°C when 
>>> accounting for feedback effects from water vapor.
>>>
>>> Errors in Absorption Coefficient Arrhenius’s original calculations 
>>> were heavily reliant on his estimates for the absorption coefficient 
>>> of CO2. The absorption coefficient is crucial because it determines 
>>> how effectively a gas can absorb infrared radiation (heat). Ångström 
>>> challenged Arrhenius’s values, suggesting they were inaccurate. This 
>>> discrepancy highlighted that Arrhenius had not fully accounted for 
>>> the complexities involved in how different gases interact with 
>>> infrared radiation.
>>>
>>> Neglecting Water Vapor’s Dominance Another critical factor in 
>>> Arrhenius’s miscalculations was his underestimation of water vapor’s 
>>> role as a greenhouse gas. Water vapor constitutes a much larger 
>>> portion of the atmosphere compared to CO2 and has a more significant 
>>> impact on climate due to its higher concentration and ability to 
>>> absorb heat across various wavelengths. While Arrhenius recognized 
>>> CO2 as an important greenhouse gas, he did not adequately emphasize 
>>> that its effects would be overshadowed by those of water vapor.
>>>
>>> Advancements in Climate Science The understanding of climate dynamics 
>>> has evolved significantly since Arrhenius’s time. Modern climate 
>>> models incorporate complex interactions among various greenhouse 
>>> gases, including feedback loops involving clouds and aerosols, which 
>>> were not part of Arrhenius’s simpler models. These advancements have 
>>> led to more accurate predictions regarding temperature increases 
>>> associated with rising levels of CO2.
>>>
>>> Conclusion: Legacy and Misunderstandings While Svante Arrhenius laid 
>>> important groundwork for understanding the greenhouse effect, 
>>> subsequent research revealed that his initial estimates were overly 
>>> optimistic due to errors in calculation methods and assumptions about 
>>> atmospheric chemistry. His work serves as both a historical milestone 
>>> in climate science and an example of how scientific understanding can 
>>> evolve over time through rigorous testing and validation.
>>
>> Chemical saturation limits EVERYTHING but is rarely taken into account.
>>
>> Lynn
>>
> 
> Certainly in this group, anything that even remotely contradicts the 
> narrative of man made global warming is never taken into account or ever 
> discussed.

We also tend to be kind of hard on flat-earthers. Oh, the intolerance!

pt