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From: Zen Cycle <funkmaster@hotmail.com>
Newsgroups: rec.bicycles.tech
Subject: Re: E-Biikes are not bicycles
Date: Fri, 27 Sep 2024 13:33:53 -0400
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On 9/27/2024 11:49 AM, Frank Krygowski wrote:
> On 9/27/2024 9:20 AM, Zen Cycle wrote:
>> On 9/27/2024 8:56 AM, Wolfgang Strobl wrote:
>>> Am Thu, 26 Sep 2024 14:32:51 -0400 schrieb Zen Cycle
>>> <funkmaster@hotmail.com>:
>>>
>>>> I also disagree that e-bike users as a rule have given up on cycling.
>>>
>>> First of all, that's not a rule, it is a fact.  Somebody riding a
>>> motorized bike isn't using an bicycle. 
>>
>> If and only if it's an objective fact that an ebike is not a bicycle. 
>> Considering the fact that the fast majority of people who ride non- 
>> motorized bicycles as well as the industry disagree with you, the 
>> statement "Somebody riding a motorized bike isn't using an bicycle" is 
>> not an objective fact, it's a subjective judgement.
> 
> Hmm. In an attempt to back away for a broader view:
> 
> I can conceive of a bike with a motor so weak and limited that nobody 
> would object to calling it a bicycle. Maybe a motor with just 15 Watts, 
> driven by a battery with one mile range?
> 
>  From there, I can conceive of a continuous spectrum, up to that Hi 
> Power Cycles Revolution X9, 104 km/h speed, 160 km range.
> 
> At some point in that spectrum, a rational person would say "That's not 
> a bicycle, it's a motorcycle." Even though, like the Revolution X9, it 
> has pedals.
> 
> The question is, where is that "not really a bicycle" threshold. I tend 
> to say America's Class I ebikes are above that threshold. I understand 
> that they're valuable to many people, but my gut says "You're not really 
> bicycling."
> 
> Also, U.S. laws (after heavy industry lobbying) allow 750 Watts and 
> power assist up to 19 mph, which is way too much in my view. British 
> laws allow 250 Watts and assist up to 15.5 mph (25 kph). I'd have 
> stopped the power assist at 12 mph, a level where novices have a much 
> better chance of staying out of trouble or causing trouble for others.
> 
> YMMV, of course.

To be clear, I consider the big bulky ebike designs to fall under Mr. 
Strobl's definition. IMHO, this is not a bicycle:

https://www.aventon.com/products/aventure2-ebike?variant=42255489466563

This however, is a bicycle:

https://www.trekbikes.com/us/en_US/bikes/electric-bikes/electric-road-bikes/domane-al-5/p/36145/?colorCode=black

I agree that 20 MPH is above what the assist should provide though.


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