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From: Jan Panteltje <alien@comet.invalid>
Newsgroups: sci.electronics.design,us.politics
Subject: Re: kids these days
Date: Mon, 30 Sep 2024 11:35:31 GMT
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On a sunny day (Mon, 30 Sep 2024 11:05:37 +0100) it happened Cursitor Doom
<cd@notformail.com> wrote in <2stkfjph6d7s5h50hafmsia5ep7209ds3e@4ax.com>:

>On Mon, 30 Sep 2024 05:31:27 GMT, Jan Panteltje <alien@comet.invalid>
>wrote:
>
>>On a sunny day (Sun, 29 Sep 2024 10:49:25 -0700) it happened john larkin
>><JL@gct.com> wrote in <de4jfjlq704080370lfofh0k0bu3njqn9u@4ax.com>:
>>
>>>On Sun, 29 Sep 2024 17:04:57 GMT, Jan Panteltje <alien@comet.invalid>
>>>wrote:
>>>
>>>>On a sunny day (Sun, 29 Sep 2024 17:41:36 +0100) it happened Cursitor Doom
>>>><cd@notformail.com> wrote in <2h0jfjhlq7ic02h5f72a3ibsksv5mkg6aj@4ax.com>:
>>>>
>>>>>On Sun, 29 Sep 2024 13:22:31 GMT, Jan Panteltje <alien@comet.invalid>
>>>>>wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>>On a sunny day (Sun, 29 Sep 2024 10:10:33 +0100) it happened Cursitor Doom
>>>>>><cd@notformail.com> wrote in <d56ifj1angpnq16qhhb0vplmlr3tt7opnf@4ax.com>:
>>>>>>
>>>>>>>On Fri, 27 Sep 2024 08:42:27 GMT, Jan Panteltje <alien@comet.invalid>
>>>>>>>wrote:
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>On a sunny day (Thu, 26 Sep 2024 16:21:31 -0700) it happened john larkin
>>>>>>>><jl@glen--canyon.com> wrote in <v1rbfj18eqbgr1t9bfvdfqqmn1q91gcfof@4ax.com>:
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>https://finance.yahoo.com/news/bosses-firing-gen-z-grads-111719818.html
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>Oh. I just hired one.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>There is a lot of truth in that article.
>>>>>>>>I have had to work with newcomers, some knew nothing 
>>>>>>>>But then when I started... in my first job designing a.o. mil stuff
>>>>>>>>I had to figure it all out for myself the same day the requests got on the table.
>>>>>>>>One old guy, who had some experience with electronics but had a lot with high power stuff..
>>>>>>>>and a manager to rule us, was the environment, and a big factory floor building the things we came up with, and
>>>>>>>>a test room (HV stuff 100 kV etc megawatt stuff.. and a little corner and oscilloscope for me to test what I came up
>>>>>>>>with,
>>>>>>>>build  proto circuits.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>Later when starting in broadcasting we got 6 month in the school benches in their own studio, while getting payed,
>>>>>>>>and exams after that, everything from audio, video, satellite, management, politics (who can do what, red phones sort of
>>>>>>>>thing), the works.
>>>>>>>>As that (video, audio etc) was my real interest, I found it relaxing and fun.
>>>>>>>>Then when you are put in charge of a real event, I remember the first day I ran alone in a head control room
>>>>>>>>I had to call my boss back from his dinner in some restaurant.. could not find the cables we had to swap
>>>>>>>>to sync some remote location,
>>>>>>>>turned out those were hidden under the floor boards ..
>>>>>>>>Did not they tell you that?
>>>>>>>> (Must have missed that :-) ).
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>It all depends,.
>>>>>>>>Do you give the poor new guy training? ANY kind of training?
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>He doesn't have to. John has this screening technique he uses for job
>>>>>>>applicants. He shows them a diagram of two 1k resistors in series with
>>>>>>>10V across them and asks them what the voltage where they join is. If
>>>>>>>they freak out, burst into tears or defenestrate themselves, he knows
>>>>>>>not to hire them. :-)
>>>>>>
>>>>>>Yes I did read that posting
>>>>>>Its hard, lemme see, e=m.c^12 likely does not help.
>>>>>>to make it easier for me I use volts, so if 3k3 + 4k7 in series gives 8 volts
>>>>>>then we know 3k3 gives 3.3 V across it and 4k7 4.7 volts across it
>>>>>>Best is to use trimpots to get the right value, no math needed...
>>>>>>And of course you need to bring the (multi?)meter impedance into play, especially for high
>>>>>>value resistors and moving coil meters from old boat anchors for example.
>>>>>>And there are LDRs and NTCs and PTCs, so we need to know all that
>>>>>>and the temperature and light intensity...
>>>>>>for the NTCs and PTCs we also need to know the current and time since switch on...
>>>>>>So no wonder if they defenestrate themselves.
>>>>>>An other issue maybe length contraction due to near light speed that may affect both measurement equipment and resistors.
>>>>>>And reading those colored bands around some resistors to get the value.
>>>>>>and wirewound, carbon composite, metal, 
>>>>>> And then J.L. did not specify if it was DeeSee or AH!See
>>>>>>Imagine 2 1k resistors, one wire-wound, the other metal flim,
>>>>>>The wire-wound would work as inductor for RF, so would some small metal ones with some turns on it..
>>>>>>And then there are tolerances, simple maybe for 2 resistors from the same batch
>>>>>>but tolerances, sometimes a silver or gold band will give a clue
>>>>>>will change the outcome.
>>>>>>So as the saying goes: "Resistance is futile, you will be assimilated"
>>>>>>Opps, composite carbon reisors maye aso be sensitve to moisture? And maybe pressue?
>>>>>>Those would often go high in teefee sets...
>>>>>>
>>>>>>...
>>>>>
>>>>>Jan, you're massively over-complicating this! :-) The resistors in my
>>>>>example are both 1k so it's half the supply rail. But you knew that
>>>>>anyway.
>>>>>The answers you gave show that you know your subject. Unfortunately,
>>>>>as we know from what John's stated here before, the graduates he
>>>>>interviews have no idea what the fuck they're doing. The Chinese are
>>>>>going to kick our arses if they aren't already.
>>>>>
>>>>>Oh - and carbon resistors are noisy. And I don't think you mentioned
>>>>>the source resistance of the supply. We could go on. And on. And
>>>>>on.... But that's not what John asked for. He only wanted a first
>>>>>approximation which would be 5 Volts. But that's too much for today's
>>>>>grads, it seems. :(
>>>>
>>>>Sure, but I find it hard to believe,
>>>>we had a lab and were required to do measurements etc.. in my school days.
>>>>Not only electronics, some mechanics too.
>>>>But indeed there is nothing like practical experience, in my school
>>>>it was known that only hobbyists would psss the exams...
>>>>
>>>>Electronics is a huge field, on top of that now comes programming.. oh and now AI..
>>>>And ever higher frequencies... ever more software (like peeseebee software for example)
>>>>protocols, what not... standarss...
>>>>
>>>>And in spite of all that : US could do a moon return in the sixties, July 1969
>>>>now they are stuck and need to be saved from the ISS..
>>>>SpaceX just did sent up a rescue mission:
>>>> https://www.bbc.com/news/articles/cy89kz8ge41o
>>>>
>>>>US IQ is dropping, no empire lasted forever..
>>>
>>>What's happening is that the normal distribution is getting wider, and
>>>not just in the USA. Some of the fringes are geniuses, and a society
>>>benefits from having even a few geniuses.
>>
>>Look at China
>>
>>
>>>Being reflexively anti-American is no substitute for thinking. I still
>>>think that the USA is the best place to design electronics.
>>
>>I observe, like I do when I use a scope to see what is happening in a circuit.
>>Now is-a-hell hits Jemen.. US weapon factories are having a party,
>>you pay more taxes..
>>Bad system.
>>
>>As your enemies get more powerful and more unite, you are a sitting duck.
>>Just a big war industry making war to sell at taxpayer's cost
>>making losses, a deficit the greatest on earth and in history.
>>
>>Should any sane person ADMIRE that disaster?
>>Half senile president and an ego tripper criminal as aspiring precedent.
>>
>>Hide under the table I've heard is the tactics recommended by you leaders.
>>?
>
>https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Lg9scNl9h4Q

Yep, that is the one :-)


>I couldn't find the version with advert at the end "sponsored by Acme
>Cigarettes - the mild smoke for kids" :-)

Oops.. 
Anyways they are all on Fetanyl or something these days?