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From: Bill Sloman <bill.sloman@ieee.org>
Newsgroups: sci.electronics.design
Subject: Re: kids these days
Date: Tue, 1 Oct 2024 14:53:32 +1000
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On 1/10/2024 1:16 am, john larkin wrote:
> On Mon, 30 Sep 2024 11:12:25 -0400, Joe Gwinn <joegwinn@comcast.net>
> wrote:
> 
>> On Sun, 29 Sep 2024 18:02:38 -0700, john larkin <JL@gct.com> wrote:
>>
>>> On Sun, 29 Sep 2024 18:29:42 -0400, Joe Gwinn <joegwinn@comcast.net>
>>> wrote:
>>>
>>>> On Sun, 29 Sep 2024 14:13:26 -0700, john larkin <JL@gct.com> wrote:
>>>>
>>>>> On Sun, 29 Sep 2024 21:53:30 +0100, Cursitor Doom <cd@notformail.com>
>>>>> wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>> On Sun, 29 Sep 2024 10:36:26 -0700, john larkin <JL@gct.com> wrote:
>>>>>>
>>>>>>> On Sun, 29 Sep 2024 13:22:31 GMT, Jan Panteltje <alien@comet.invalid>
>>>>>>> wrote:
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> On a sunny day (Sun, 29 Sep 2024 10:10:33 +0100) it happened Cursitor Doom
>>>>>>>> <cd@notformail.com> wrote in <d56ifj1angpnq16qhhb0vplmlr3tt7opnf@4ax.com>:
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> On Fri, 27 Sep 2024 08:42:27 GMT, Jan Panteltje <alien@comet.invalid>
>>>>>>>>> wrote:
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> On a sunny day (Thu, 26 Sep 2024 16:21:31 -0700) it happened john larkin
>>>>>>>>>> <jl@glen--canyon.com> wrote in <v1rbfj18eqbgr1t9bfvdfqqmn1q91gcfof@4ax.com>:
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> https://finance.yahoo.com/news/bosses-firing-gen-z-grads-111719818.html
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> Oh. I just hired one.
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> There is a lot of truth in that article.
>>>>>>>>>> I have had to work with newcomers, some knew nothing
>>>>>>>>>> But then when I started... in my first job designing a.o. mil stuff
>>>>>>>>>> I had to figure it all out for myself the same day the requests got on the table.
>>>>>>>>>> One old guy, who had some experience with electronics but had a lot with high power stuff..
>>>>>>>>>> and a manager to rule us, was the environment, and a big factory floor building the things we came up with, and
>>>>>>>>>> a test room (HV stuff 100 kV etc megawatt stuff.. and a little corner and oscilloscope for me to test what I came up with,
>>>>>>>>>> build  proto circuits.
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> Later when starting in broadcasting we got 6 month in the school benches in their own studio, while getting payed,
>>>>>>>>>> and exams after that, everything from audio, video, satellite, management, politics (who can do what, red phones sort of
>>>>>>>>>> thing), the works.
>>>>>>>>>> As that (video, audio etc) was my real interest, I found it relaxing and fun.
>>>>>>>>>> Then when you are put in charge of a real event, I remember the first day I ran alone in a head control room
>>>>>>>>>> I had to call my boss back from his dinner in some restaurant.. could not find the cables we had to swap
>>>>>>>>>> to sync some remote location,
>>>>>>>>>> turned out those were hidden under the floor boards ..
>>>>>>>>>> Did not they tell you that?
>>>>>>>>>> (Must have missed that :-) ).
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> It all depends,.
>>>>>>>>>> Do you give the poor new guy training? ANY kind of training?
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> He doesn't have to. John has this screening technique he uses for job
>>>>>>>>> applicants. He shows them a diagram of two 1k resistors in series with
>>>>>>>>> 10V across them and asks them what the voltage where they join is. If
>>>>>>>>> they freak out, burst into tears or defenestrate themselves, he knows
>>>>>>>>> not to hire them. :-)
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Yes I did read that posting
>>>>>>>> Its hard, lemme see, e=m.c^12 likely does not help.
>>>>>>>> to make it easier for me I use volts, so if 3k3 + 4k7 in series gives 8 volts
>>>>>>>> then we know 3k3 gives 3.3 V across it and 4k7 4.7 volts across it
>>>>>>>> Best is to use trimpots to get the right value, no math needed...
>>>>>>>> And of course you need to bring the (multi?)meter impedance into play, especially for high
>>>>>>>> value resistors and moving coil meters from old boat anchors for example.
>>>>>>>> And there are LDRs and NTCs and PTCs, so we need to know all that
>>>>>>>> and the temperature and light intensity...
>>>>>>>> for the NTCs and PTCs we also need to know the current and time since switch on...
>>>>>>>> So no wonder if they defenestrate themselves.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> I wouldn't hire someone who complicates a simple question into
>>>>>>> paralysis.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> An other issue maybe length contraction due to near light speed that may affect both measurement equipment and resistors.
>>>>>>>> And reading those colored bands around some resistors to get the value.
>>>>>>>> and wirewound, carbon composite, metal,
>>>>>>>> And then J.L. did not specify if it was DeeSee or AH!See
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> I draw a 10 volt battery connected to two resistors, 9K in series with
>>>>>>> 1K.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> What's the voltage across the 1K?
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> I hired a 3-month intern a month ago who failed the test. He said 9
>>>>>>> volts. I hired him anyway and fired him as an intern on Friday. He's
>>>>>>> full time now. He's mostly a software engineer. I'm teaching him basic
>>>>>>> electronics now.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> I dream of some day finding a kid who gets the voltage divider right
>>>>>>> and has something intelligent so say about the next test, an NPN
>>>>>>> emitter follower.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> What do you ask them about that?
>>>>>
>>>>> V+=10. Two 10K resistors up and down to set the base voltage. Emitter
>>>>> 1K to ground.
>>>>>
>>>>> What's the base voltage? Some people have said 0.6, because base
>>>>> voltages are always 0.6.
>>>>>
>>>>> What's the emitter voltage? Collector current?
>>>>>
>>>>> Anything else to say?
>>>>>
>>>>> Trick question: what's the collector voltage?
>>>>
>>>> Smart-ass answer:  Who knows ... nobody uses vacuum tubes or bipolar
>>>> transistors any more.
>>>>
>>>> Joe Gwinn
>>>
>>> So assume a common n-channel mosfet, like a 2N7000. What are the
>>> answers?
>>
>> Where's the Microcontroller Programmers Guide?
>>
>> Joe Gwinn
> 
> So many people here prefer snarks to parts.
> 
> Probably few actually understand simple circuits.

John Larkin doesn't seem to understand the two transistor 
emitter-coupled monostable.

-- 
Bill Sloman, Sydney