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Path: ...!news.mixmin.net!eternal-september.org!feeder3.eternal-september.org!news.eternal-september.org!.POSTED!not-for-mail From: Klaus Vestergaard Kragelund <klauskvik@hotmail.com> Newsgroups: sci.electronics.design Subject: Re: Minimum clearance for 230V AC. Date: Fri, 4 Oct 2024 00:22:03 +0200 Organization: A noiseless patient Spider Lines: 52 Message-ID: <vdn5ea$3t7ts$2@dont-email.me> References: <b5uLO.36140$FIff.36030@fx02.ams1> <nMvLO.2934182$EVn.1109923@fx04.ams4> <j0ntfjhb1dkki2v0lj0a136lol2d5h89v0@4ax.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Injection-Date: Fri, 04 Oct 2024 00:22:03 +0200 (CEST) Injection-Info: dont-email.me; posting-host="1bf2c0c7b1365d3f3fe1007d11b1902c"; logging-data="4104124"; mail-complaints-to="abuse@eternal-september.org"; posting-account="U2FsdGVkX19PfQYGL2y42a3HidMRbGqdzk6uYgu1cc4=" User-Agent: Mozilla Thunderbird Cancel-Lock: sha1:5bzFPN1u8mKhCGzV5m2fBIpw1LM= Content-Language: en-US In-Reply-To: <j0ntfjhb1dkki2v0lj0a136lol2d5h89v0@4ax.com> Bytes: 3221 On 03-10-2024 20:03, john larkin wrote: > On Thu, 3 Oct 2024 22:05:37 +1000, Chris Jones > <lugnut808@spam.yahoo.com> wrote: > >> On 3/10/2024 8:11 pm, Pimpom wrote: >>> What's the minimum surface clearance you consider adequate for 230VAC, >>> on FR4 without slots or added creepage? Forget about IPC-2221 unless you >>> base your layout strictly on it. >>> >>> Personally, I try to maintain 3mm edge-to-edge between tracks and pads, >>> more if space permits. What do you think? >> >> The distance along a surface is called creepage in the standards. >> >> The required distance depends on whether the insulation is supposed to >> be single insulation (functional, basic or supplementary) or double >> insulation (reinforced insulation). >> >> Basically, if the insulation failing ought not to kill someone because >> the part that would become live is either protectively earthed or >> separated by supplementary insulation from the user, then a smaller >> creepage is allowable. >> >> If the insulation failing could immediately give someone a shock because >> there is no protective earthing or supplementary insulation, then a >> larger creepage distance is required. >> >> The exact distances required in different standards tend to be >> different, though I think a lot of different products that used to be >> subject to different standards have recently been grouped into one set >> of standards, IEC62368-1. >> >> There are some tables here: >> https://www.powerctc.com/en/node/4757 >> >> I think you are going to come up with something like 2.5mm for basic >> insulation and 5mm for reinforced, but you should check carefully what >> the standards say, and for some classes of equipment it can be much >> more, like 6mm or 8mm. >> > > > What about voltage clearances for inner-layer traces on a multilayer > board? Same layer and between layers? > > > Typical inner layers in x-y direction is 1.2mm for reinforced. If you do impulse voltage testing, you may get that down to 0.5mm In the z direction, it's 0.4mm IIRC