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Path: ...!news.roellig-ltd.de!open-news-network.org!weretis.net!feeder8.news.weretis.net!news.szaf.org!nntp-feed.chiark.greenend.org.uk!ewrotcd!news.eyrie.org!beagle.ediacara.org!.POSTED.beagle.ediacara.org!not-for-mail From: RonO <rokimoto557@gmail.com> Newsgroups: talk.origins Subject: Noise leads to the perceived increase in evolutionary rates over short time scales Date: Sat, 5 Oct 2024 10:38:53 -0500 Organization: A noiseless patient Spider Lines: 30 Sender: to%beagle.ediacara.org Approved: moderator@beagle.ediacara.org Message-ID: <vdrmid$q8g5$1@dont-email.me> Reply-To: rokimoto557@gmail.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Injection-Info: beagle.ediacara.org; posting-host="beagle.ediacara.org:3.132.105.89"; logging-data="19559"; mail-complaints-to="usenet@beagle.ediacara.org" User-Agent: Mozilla Thunderbird To: talk-origins@moderators.isc.org Cancel-Lock: sha1:RGBAeKPaXtPTTmnlKEaVQM+EAeU= Return-Path: <news@eternal-september.org> X-Original-To: talk-origins@ediacara.org Delivered-To: talk-origins@ediacara.org id 3599522986F; Sat, 05 Oct 2024 11:38:33 -0400 (EDT) by beagle.ediacara.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 1027622978C for <talk-origins@ediacara.org>; Sat, 05 Oct 2024 11:38:31 -0400 (EDT) id 790E65FD1B; Sat, 5 Oct 2024 15:38:57 +0000 (UTC) Delivered-To: talk-origins@moderators.isc.org by mod-relay.zaccari.net (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 495B85FD18 for <talk-origins@moderators.isc.org>; Sat, 5 Oct 2024 15:38:57 +0000 (UTC) DKIM-Filter: OpenDKIM Filter v2.11.0 mod-relay.zaccari.net 495B85FD18 (using TLSv1.3 with cipher TLS_AES_256_GCM_SHA384 (256/256 bits) key-exchange X25519 server-signature ECDSA (P-256)) (No client certificate requested) by smtp.eternal-september.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id B57CD5F871 for <talk-origins@moderators.isc.org>; Sat, 5 Oct 2024 15:38:54 +0000 (UTC) Authentication-Results: name/B57CD5F871; dmarc=fail (p=none dis=none) header.from=gmail.com id 3FDF9DC01A9; Sat, 5 Oct 2024 17:38:54 +0200 (CEST) X-Injection-Date: Sat, 05 Oct 2024 17:38:54 +0200 (CEST) X-Auth-Sender: U2FsdGVkX19t76bt+f/q0Mn5NIyzN9m7rziJVqszzkg= Content-Language: en-US FORGED_GMAIL_RCVD,FORGED_MUA_MOZILLA,FREEMAIL_FORGED_FROMDOMAIN, FREEMAIL_FROM,FREEMAIL_REPLYTO_END_DIGIT,HEADER_FROM_DIFFERENT_DOMAINS, NML_ADSP_CUSTOM_MED,SPF_HELO_NONE,SPF_PASS,URIBL_BLOCKED autolearn=no autolearn_force=no version=3.4.6 smtp.eternal-september.org Bytes: 4106 second attempt to resend: I sent this post yesterday, but it didn't show up. https://journals.plos.org/ploscompbiol/article?id=10.1371/journal.pcbi.1012458 This paper concludes that the perceived acceleration in the rate of evolution in relatively recent timescales or for short intensively studied periods of time are due to "noise" in the data. The noise seems to be the normal distribution of variation within any existing population and what was found as fossils of past species, and even errors of base calling for sequencing. I guess when you sample multiple individuals that died within a relatively short period of time that the then existing range of variation in the population gets haphazardly sampled in some temporal order and even randomizing the samples relative to time results in the same acceleration rate. For DNA sequence you would be dealing with standing genetic variation within a population and the fact that the shorter the time period under study the fewer differences that you would observe between individuals, so sequencing errors might inflate differences for short periods of time more than for much longer periods of time, and the standing genetic variation found within the population might not be sampled enough to know where an individual fell in the distribution of variation that existed. Probably not unexpected, but something that seems to have been missed. Science Daily article: https://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2024/10/241003123239.htm Ron Okimoto