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Path: ...!weretis.net!feeder9.news.weretis.net!news.quux.org!eternal-september.org!feeder2.eternal-september.org!news.eternal-september.org!.POSTED!not-for-mail From: olcott <polcott333@gmail.com> Newsgroups: comp.theory Subject: Re: The philosophy of computation reformulates existing ideas on a new basis --- TYPO Date: Tue, 29 Oct 2024 09:54:10 -0500 Organization: A noiseless patient Spider Lines: 65 Message-ID: <vfqsui$1jg6i$2@dont-email.me> References: <veoift$29dtl$2@dont-email.me> <veoq3j$2aqp2$1@dont-email.me> <vf716u$1607j$1@dont-email.me> <vf7ks8$1d1vt$1@dont-email.me> <vf8eu5$1h5mj$2@dont-email.me> <vfdk8g$2lgl1$1@dont-email.me> <vfdrb8$2mcdg$1@dont-email.me> <vffk1i$33iat$1@dont-email.me> <vfgaev$36im7$5@dont-email.me> <vfi743$3kr1e$1@dont-email.me> <vfip3l$3ner2$2@dont-email.me> <1bc1ab08ec47bf818ddff1d4f63b542ceadd6985@i2pn2.org> <vfjokd$3su2f$1@dont-email.me> <vfk3jl$3kr0c$5@i2pn2.org> <vfk4lk$3ukdm$1@dont-email.me> <vfl8o9$3mnmt$5@i2pn2.org> <vfli1h$fj8s$1@dont-email.me> <vflue8$3nvp8$2@i2pn2.org> <vfmd8m$k2m7$1@dont-email.me> <bcd82d9f8a987d3884220c0df7b8f7204cb9de3e@i2pn2.org> <vfmueh$mqn9$1@dont-email.me> <ff039b922cabbb6d44f90aa71a52d8c2f446b6ab@i2pn2.org> <vfo95k$11qs1$1@dont-email.me> <vfp8c0$3tobi$2@i2pn2.org> <vfpcko$1837o$3@dont-email.me> <vfpish$3u885$2@i2pn2.org> <vfpjk2$1976k$1@dont-email.me> <086fc32f14bcc004466d3128b0fe585b27377399@i2pn2.org> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Injection-Date: Tue, 29 Oct 2024 15:54:11 +0100 (CET) Injection-Info: dont-email.me; posting-host="393123f3287a9aeded778d1158c0bfd1"; logging-data="1687762"; mail-complaints-to="abuse@eternal-september.org"; posting-account="U2FsdGVkX197+rTJd4S4YX/k/CwkT08q" User-Agent: Mozilla Thunderbird Cancel-Lock: sha1:UjJ1CDBapBBf+vgGgN04nE4Yz0c= X-Antivirus-Status: Clean Content-Language: en-US In-Reply-To: <086fc32f14bcc004466d3128b0fe585b27377399@i2pn2.org> X-Antivirus: Norton (VPS 241029-2, 10/29/2024), Outbound message Bytes: 4687 On 10/29/2024 5:50 AM, Richard Damon wrote: > On 10/28/24 11:08 PM, olcott wrote: >> On 10/28/2024 9:56 PM, Richard Damon wrote: >>> On 10/28/24 9:09 PM, olcott wrote: >>>> On 10/28/2024 6:56 PM, Richard Damon wrote: >>>>> >>>>> It is IMPOSSIBLE to emulate DDD per the x86 semantics without the >>>>> code for HHH, so it needs to be part of the input. >>>>> >>>> >>>> *You seemed to be a totally Jackass here* >>>> You are not that stupid >>>> You are not that ignorant >>>> and this is not your ADD >>>> >>>> _DDD() >>>> [00002172] 55 push ebp ; housekeeping >>>> [00002173] 8bec mov ebp,esp ; housekeeping >>>> [00002175] 6872210000 push 00002172 ; push DDD >>>> [0000217a] e853f4ffff call 000015d2 ; call HHH(DDD) >>>> [0000217f] 83c404 add esp,+04 >>>> [00002182] 5d pop ebp >>>> [00002183] c3 ret >>>> Size in bytes:(0018) [00002183] >>>> >>>> At machine address 0000217a HHH emulates itself emulating >>>> DDD without knowing that it is emulating itself. >>>> >>> >>> Then how did it convert the call HHH into an emulation of DDD again? >>> >> >> When HHH (unknowingly) emulates itself emulating DDD this >> emulated HHH is going to freaking emulate DDD. >> >> Did you think it was going to play poker? >> > > Which is what it would do, get stuck and fail to be a decider. It might > figure out that it is emulating an emulating decider, at which point it > knows that the decider might choose to abort its conditional emulation > to return, so it needs to emulate further. > > Only by recognizing itself, does it have grounds to say that if I don't > abort, it never will, and thus I am stuck, so I need to abort. > Counter-factual. This algorithm has no ability to KNOW ITS OWN CODE. https://github.com/plolcott/x86utm/blob/master/Halt7.c // page 801 *That people fail to agree with this and also fail to* *correctly point out any error seems to indicate dishonestly* *or lack of technical competence* DDD emulated by HHH according to the semantics of the x86 language cannot possibly reach its own "return" instruction whether or not any HHH ever aborts its emulation of DDD. I read, reread again and again to make sure that my understanding is correct. You seems to glance at a few words before spouting off a canned rebuttal that does not even apply to my words. -- Copyright 2024 Olcott "Talent hits a target no one else can hit; Genius hits a target no one else can see." Arthur Schopenhauer