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From: AMuzi <am@yellowjersey.org>
Newsgroups: rec.bicycles.tech
Subject: Re: Daytime running light popularity
Date: Wed, 6 Nov 2024 16:54:02 -0600
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On 11/6/2024 3:05 PM, Roger Merriman wrote:
> Frank Krygowski <frkrygow@sbcglobal.net> wrote:
>> On 11/6/2024 6:03 AM, Roger Merriman wrote:
>>> Frank Krygowski <frkrygow@gXXmail.com> wrote:
>>>>
>>>> At the location I described, in front of the library, it's two wide lanes.
>>>
>>> As it approaches the bridge yes but doesn’t seem to be any narrower than
>>> when it’s 3 lanes, ie it’s still a wide car centric road.
>>
>> Of course it's a "car centric road." 99.999% of roads in the U.S. are
>> "car centric," and will always be so. The history and geography of the
>> U.S. guarantee that.
>>
> History I’d agree with geography no, considering that American cities where
> built by rail, and has been high speed rail for 50/60 years in Uk and
> probably earlier than that elsewhere.
> 
> America could of had a high speed rail network, ie city to city rather than
> having interstate highways and interchanges in and though the cities which
> is very much a American thing, ie to be able to drive at 70mph into and
> though a city.
> 
> And that was purely a political decision.
> 
> 
>> Which is why building bike lanes to get people out of their cars is a
>> delusion. Spending fortunes to build "good" bike lanes (as if that's
>> really possible) is also a fantasy. The most that happens, with
>> extremely rare exceptions is what you've called "box ticking exercises."
>>
> No it can be done number of the london ones do work and have increased
> numbers but and this is the gotcha you do need to go all in, ie you have to
> accept that your going to take space away from motorists and slow them at
> junctions or even prevent turns at certain junctions and so on.
> 
> Ie unlike that segregated cyclelane you’ve posted where cars can turn
> across with a nice bell curve so can maintain speed, no attempt to narrow
> the junction or install a raised bed to slow cars down or so on.
> 
> It can be done but not if you keep the car centric system in place.
> 
>> Even the rail-trail linear parks often have problems, as Andrew and
>> others have mentioned. But in my mind, those are a separate issue. They
>> really are recreational parks. Very few of them have any transportation
>> function.
>>   > Mind you did see a video of locally some car in a “must get past”
>> overtook
>>> a cyclists doing 20mph past a speed camera, which triggered the camera! Car
>>> not bike which would have being doing fair bit more than 20mph to overtake.
>>>
>>> Mind you it’s shocking how folks didn’t understand how average speed camera
>>> work when they first started to be rolled out some 10 or so years ago.
>>
>> As more evidence of "car centric," any proposal for speed cameras in the
>> U.S. gets militant opposition. Motorists absolutely hate the
>> inconvenience of having to obey speed limits.
>>
> Can’t say uk motorists like it much with claims of war on the motorists but
> realistically like lots of places the balance of how road and in particular
> cities are shaped is changing away from just cars.
> 
> Roger Merriman

Nothing against trains or cycling on bucolic country lanes 
(which I do), but cultural attitudes and expectations are 
different here in USA than in UK.

Land's End to John O'Groats is 840 miles which distance 
doesn't even get me from here to New York or Denver or to 
Houston. It is roughly the distance across Texas. Higher 
auto use rates make more sense here than for you and make 
more sense for you than for Nederlanders.

Deconflicting rail traffic and Interstate highways through 
cities is an ongoing struggle but well worth the effort and 
both are improving steadily. I don't see a serious conflict 
with either in terms of cycling.

-- 
Andrew Muzi
am@yellowjersey.org
Open every day since 1 April, 1971