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From: Mild Shock <janburse@fastmail.fm>
Newsgroups: sci.logic
Subject: NEW Logic versus OLD Logic (Re: Was Poincare crushed by the New)
Date: Mon, 6 Jan 2025 10:02:31 +0100
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Hi,

Poincare gives an interesting insight, mostly forgotten,
that the last 100 years brought us a new logic:

Science and method
by Poincaré, Henri, 1854-1912
https://archive.org/details/sciencemethod00poinuoft/page/n3/mode/2up

His struggle starts at page 160, The New Logics.
Similar Einstein was New Mechanics for him.

So what are NEW and OLD logic:

- NEW Logic: The Logic for the Past Atom Age
   The new logic is basically a logic that allows to
   formalize the real numbers, for example via set theory.
   It was judged so important that the whole education
   underwent a transformation:

One of the motives was the Sputnik shock, as a result
of which there was a great need to catch up
educationally in the West.
https://de.wikipedia.org/wiki/Neue_Mathematik

- OLD Logic: The Logic for the Coming Artificial Age
   The old logic is basically Aristotelian Begriffslogik.
   Bis zum 19. Jahrhundert war es die dominante Tradition.
   Die Logiker für eine solche Logik waren mehr Grammatiker
   und Wissensimgenieure, und weniger Mathematiker die der
   Physik zugedient haben.

https://de.wikipedia.org/wiki/Begriffslogik

LLMs give a new spin on OLD Logic, which has sent
shockwaves into hardcore NEW Logic proponents
as a means for Begriffslogik. Especially the use of
of less formal means based on natural language itself,

which was somehow seen as a problem, could be a solution:

Modern ontologies:
•    Philosophers have debated the foundations for centuries.
•    They emphasize technical terms defined in logic.
•    But people talk. write. and think in natural languages (NLs).
•    Any distinctions not represented in NLs tend to be ignored.

The Great Debate between John Sowa and Barry Smith
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fhYaTW5MK_U

Bye

Mild Shock schrieb:
> 
> Poincare had quite some problems with the
> formal revolution that took place as well
> in the last 100 or more years, starting with
> 
> things like naive set theory and its antinomies,
> ending with computer formalized proofs of the Keppler
> packing nowadays. He wrote a lengthy book:
> 
> Science and method
> by Poincaré, Henri, 1854-1912
> https://archive.org/details/sciencemethod00poinuoft/page/n3/mode/2up
> 
> His struggle starts at page 160, The New Logics.
> Similar Einstein was New Mechanics for him.
> Mostlikely Poincaré nowadays would be a form of
> 
> Sabine Hossenfelder with 100 YouTube videos and
> possibly many followers. Poincaré faced the
> destiny of any old fart that became irrelevant
> 
> over the time and turned into a commentator.