Path: news.eternal-september.org!eternal-september.org!.POSTED!not-for-mail
From: Frank Krygowski <frkrygow@sbcglobal.net>
Newsgroups: rec.bicycles.tech
Subject: Re: Suspension losses
Date: Thu, 16 Jan 2025 16:25:43 -0500
Organization: A noiseless patient Spider
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On 1/16/2025 1:58 PM, Zen Cycle wrote:
> On 1/16/2025 12:18 PM, Frank Krygowski wrote:
>> On 1/16/2025 7:14 AM, zen cycle wrote:
>>> On 1/15/2025 6:39 PM, Frank Krygowski wrote:
>>>>
>>>> You should look at the energy used for the controls and think about 
>>>> what becomes of it. Do that in microcopic detail.
>>>
>>> If you think it all ends up as heat (IR spectrum) you have a gross 
>>> misunderstanding of electronics. First off, the indicators dissipate 
>>> energy in the visible light spectrum (this is why LEDs are more 
>>> efficient lighting than incandescent, very little energy is used in 
>>> the IR spectrum). 
>>
>> OK, a thought experiment: Take an adiabatic container - that is, a 
>> _perfectly_ insulated box (a physical impossibility, but useful for 
>> our analysis). Let the box contain whatever you like - just air, some 
>> solid objects, whatever.
>>
>> Cut an LED sized hole in it and insert an LED of your choice so it 
>> shines into the box. Turn on the LED.
>>
>> What happens to the light entering the box? Obviously, you don't end 
>> up with a box full of light, so it isn't stored; it somehow goes away. 
> 
> lol...no, it doesn't 'go away'. For all intents and purposes it suffers 
> the safe fate as Schrödinger's cat.

No cats necessary. If you opened such a box, would you really expect to 
see a bright flash of the released light? If so, you'd be disappointed.

> 
>> And what happens to the temperature inside the box, and why?
> 
> It will rise somewhat due to the residual IR energy from the system. 
> Visible spectrum LEDs do emit some IR, just not nearly as much as 
> incandescents (given the same lux)

Even if only visible spectrum light is emitted, the temperature will 
rise. The visible light energy will be converted to heat.

> So _all_ forms of energy convert to heat? You should write a paper on that.

Those papers were written long, long ago. See 
https://www.physlink.com/education/askexperts/ae261.cfm for some hints.

"That's a famous question that people thought a lot about in the 
nineteenth century. It goes under the name of the 'Heat Death of the 
Universe.' In short, once all of the energy in the universe is converted 
to heat then the universe will be in equilibrium -- everything will be 
of the same temperature and entropy will remain constant forever."

-- 
- Frank Krygowski