Path: ...!eternal-september.org!feeder3.eternal-september.org!news.eternal-september.org!eternal-september.org!.POSTED!not-for-mail
From: Frank Krygowski <frkrygow@sbcglobal.net>
Newsgroups: rec.bicycles.tech
Subject: Re: Ove Interest?
Date: Mon, 17 Feb 2025 11:15:26 -0500
Organization: A noiseless patient Spider
Lines: 66
Message-ID: <vovnb1$177rr$3@dont-email.me>
References: <vop413$3ojl2$4@dont-email.me> <voq66s$1vl7$2@dont-email.me>
 <m1bnsbFl7s3U1@mid.individual.net> <voqitv$4aek$2@dont-email.me>
 <voqnbk$59iv$1@dont-email.me> <vor1g7$70t2$1@dont-email.me>
 <jr62rjlal8ra20q6uqdhmqti7hvif8mpps@4ax.com>
 <9ed2rjdp07d6kh573u6ghkdbcnjt0t1lrt@4ax.com> <voro9s$ekdl$1@dont-email.me>
 <dgc3rjph84p7gn62it0p52thhg0fb9lvvh@4ax.com>
 <82g3rj196rf6gou38ev0k232eu5h419jhp@4ax.com> <votfeh$ns08$3@dont-email.me>
 <lrh4rjpqrohdo3842c94fm5prb85mcvc8d@4ax.com>
 <jo05rj5g8vvnoe9rrm427qi8oajhaikmri@4ax.com> <voubm1$s9r4$4@dont-email.me>
 <vovhmv$16aef$1@dont-email.me>
Reply-To: frkrygow@gmail.com
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8; format=flowed
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit
Injection-Date: Mon, 17 Feb 2025 17:15:30 +0100 (CET)
Injection-Info: dont-email.me; posting-host="0635e581e5b36a461334fd0f38750c59";
	logging-data="1286011"; mail-complaints-to="abuse@eternal-september.org";	posting-account="U2FsdGVkX1+GBgA0iPUqnAx/gznGIKYU4lnfa+omXKI="
User-Agent: Mozilla Thunderbird
Cancel-Lock: sha1:eMSPv9eyly6bwzAjpq+TrV6jGXE=
In-Reply-To: <vovhmv$16aef$1@dont-email.me>
Content-Language: en-US
Bytes: 4357

On 2/17/2025 9:39 AM, AMuzi wrote:
> On 2/16/2025 9:50 PM, Frank Krygowski wrote:
>> On 2/16/2025 8:34 PM, John B. wrote:
>>> On Sun, 16 Feb 2025 15:17:39 -0500, Catrike Ryder
>>> <Soloman@old.bikers.org> wrote:
>>>
>>>> On Sun, 16 Feb 2025 14:48:31 -0500, Frank Krygowski
>>>> <frkrygow@sbcglobal.net> wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>> I know you love guns, but what I've posted are the facts. You 
>>>>> should be
>>>>> able to love guns while understanding that their value is highly 
>>>>> overrated.
>>>>
>>>> "The data is clear that their assumption is false. The people with
>>>> guns in the house are _more_ likely to suffer serious violence, and
>>>> that's true no matter where they live."  ...
>>>
>>> I suspect that if you were to study all cases of someone murdering
>>> another person in the same household you will find many cases where a
>>> gun was used. However that doesn't mean that it is the gun that is at
>>> fault. 
>>
>> I did not say "the gun was at fault." I said those in houses with guns 
>> are more likely to suffer serious violence than those in houses 
>> without guns, no matter where they live. I don't blame the gun. I 
>> blame the people owning and/or using the gun. But nevertheless, those 
>> who got the gun "for protection" tend to come out worse.
>>
>>> In short, the statement that a gun in the house is dangerious is just
>>> what the "Anti Gunners" want to hear and so they repeat it over and
>>> over and over.
>>
>> OK, John, if you were a researcher, what data would you use to answer 
>> this question:
>>
>> Are people living in a house with a gun safer or more at more danger 
>> than people living in a house with no gun?
>>
>> Remember, to a researcher, tales of your childhood don't count as 
>> research. Neither do your strongly held opinions. You need good data.
>>
>> (I suspect you'll evade answering my question.)
>>
>>
> 
> Well, since there are many times more successful firearm defense 
> incidents than firearm homicides I'd say your conclusion is unclear at 
> best.

First, your assertion is almost certainly wrong.  See 
https://www.americanprogress.org/article/debunking-the-guns-make-us-safer-myth/

Second, it doesn't address the question at hand. Again, what researchers 
have found is not people in gun households getting shot by home 
invaders. Instead, they find its FAR more common that one person in a 
gun household is shot by another person living in the same house.

I've known two women who were beaten and threatened with death by their 
husbands, before their divorces. Both were sure that if the relationship 
continued, they would have been killed. The most likely tool would have 
been the guy's gun.


-- 
- Frank Krygowski