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From: Bill Sloman <bill.sloman@ieee.org>
Newsgroups: sci.electronics.design
Subject: Re: OT: Cracking Speech by JDV!
Date: Tue, 18 Feb 2025 13:00:07 +1100
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On 18/02/2025 12:45 am, Cursitor Doom wrote:
> On Mon, 17 Feb 2025 12:57:58 +0000, liz@poppyrecords.invalid.invalid
> (Liz Tuddenham) wrote:
> 
>> Jeroen Belleman <jeroen@nospam.please> wrote:
>>
>>> On 2/17/25 11:09, Liz Tuddenham wrote:
>>>> Bill Sloman <bill.sloman@ieee.org> wrote:
>>>>
>>>>> On 17/02/2025 5:17 am, Cursitor Doom wrote:
>>>>>> On Sun, 16 Feb 2025 10:10:26 +0000, liz@poppyrecords.invalid.invalid
>>>>>> (Liz Tuddenham) wrote:
>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Joe Gwinn <joegwinn@comcast.net> wrote:
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> On Sat, 15 Feb 2025 12:31:48 -0800, john larkin <JL@gct.com> wrote:
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> On Sat, 15 Feb 2025 10:53:37 -0700, Don Y
>>>>>>>>> <blockedofcourse@foo.invalid> wrote:
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> On 2/15/2025 3:07 AM, Liz Tuddenham wrote: > It was clearly aimed
>>>>>>>>>> at the home market; he was supposed to be there to > talk about
>>>>>>>>>> security in Europe and never even mentioned Ukraine.  All
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> We (US) are governed by "entertainers", now more than ever.  It is
>>>>>>>>>> the nature of our "system" that we reward people who can win races
>>>>>>>>>> instead of govern.
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> And, all of them end up "old and gray" (or, oldER and BALD as is
>>>>>>>>>> the case of The Orange One) in the process.
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> that this speech has done is to turn most European countries
>>>>>>>>>>> against the kind of ignorant, thuggish, self-serving America he
>>>>>>>>>>> represents. Fortunately there are still many Americans who are
>>>>>>>>>>> not like that.
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> This is probably a good thing.  Unless you are Putin.  It's pretty
>>>>>>>>>> clear that Russia is a Potemkin power -- definitely not a "World
>>>>>>>>>> Power".
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> The threat he poses is the threat ANY nation possessing nukes
>>>>>>>>>> poses. Care to make any guesses as to how many exist?  Or, *could*
>>>>>>>>>> exist if gifted the technology?
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> The big question about Russian missiles and nukes is, will they
>>>>>>>>> work?
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> The Russians know that their stuff isn't especially reliable, then
>>>>>>>> and now.  So they have always used lots of warheads, so at least one
>>>>>>>> will work.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Four of them came down in Romania last week - we haven't heard much
>>>>>>> about that on the UK news.  Two were in Moldavia, close to the
>>>>>>> border, so they might have been a mistake, but two more were well
>>>>>>> inside Romania.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Perhaps if we hadn't breached the Minsk II Treaty and expanded NATO up
>>>>>> to Russia's doorstep, none of this ghastly mess would have happened in
>>>>>> the first place.
>>>>>
>>>>> The Russian invasion of Ukraine is a reminder of why Russia's neighbours
>>>>> were so keen to join NATO.
>>>>>
>>>>> The ghastly mess is entirely driven by Russia's territorial ambitions.
>>>>
>>>> ...and the failure of the rest of the World to react to it strongly and
>>>> quickly enough.
>>>>
>>>>
>>>
>>> Which would have triggered another world war.
>>
>> That's what Putin was banking on us believing, after he had failed at
>> Blitzkrieg.  That threat held us at bay long enough for him to turn the
>> invasion into a war of attrition, which he had a better chance of
>> winning.
>>
>> The outcome of a war of attrition depends on the resources each side can
>> draw upon, which means the warring parties are entirely dependent on
>> their friends.  Trump withdrawing American assistance isn't a neutral
>> act, it is positive support for Putin.  Europe will suffer the
>> consequences first - then it will rebound on America.
>>
>> Quoting you from another post:
>>> So, if he was afraid of having a NATO Ukraine on his border, he
>>> hasn't yet realized what a threat a re-ARMED Europe would pose in
>>> that same geographical position.  Trump's trash talking may result
>>> in a EUTO (without the US) that feels empowered to push back on
>>> future issues without "consent" from the US.
>>
>> You predicted that very well:  There is a meeting of European heads of
>> state in Paris today to discuss security in Europe independently of NATO
>> (i.e. a EUTO).
> 
> Your idol Starmer has already backtracked on his commitment to
> Ukraine. He'll put British army boots on the ground - but only to keep
> the peace after the US and Russia have reached a deal. It's quite
> right to keep Ukraine out of the discussions. The maggot that runs the
> place is a warmonger and a danger to world peace.

Cursitor Doom does like his nonsense to be utterly fatuous. There's no 
evidence that Zelensky is any kid of warmonger. Russian had been 
nibbling at the Ukraine for some five years before Zelensky got elected 
- they'd already snaffled Crimea and encouraged separatists in the 
Donbass. The warmonger here is Putin, as anybody sane would know.

-- 
Bill Sloman, Sydney