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From: Paul S Person <psperson@old.netcom.invalid>
Newsgroups: rec.arts.sf.written
Subject: Re: The US Likely Has 8 YearsAt MostBefore Crisis
Date: Wed, 23 Jul 2025 08:12:07 -0700
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On Tue, 22 Jul 2025 20:13:24 -0700, Bobbie Sellers
<bliss-sf4ever@dslextreme.com> wrote:

>
>
>On 7/22/25 08:56, Paul S Person wrote:
>> On Mon, 21 Jul 2025 20:36:49 -0700, Bobbie Sellers
>> <bliss-sf4ever@dslextreme.com> wrote:
>>=20
>>>
>>>
>>> On 7/21/25 20:16, The Horny Goat wrote:
>>>> On Mon, 21 Jul 2025 08:08:54 -0700, Paul S Person
>>>> <psperson@old.netcom.invalid> wrote:
>>>>
>>>>> On Sun, 20 Jul 2025 09:11:00 -0700, Bobbie Sellers
>>>>> <bliss-sf4ever@dslextreme.com> wrote:
>>>>>>
>>>>>> On 7/20/25 08:49, The Horny Goat wrote:
>>>>>>> On Sat, 21 Jun 2025 18:21:29 -0700, Dimensional Traveler
>>>>>>> <dtravel@sonic.net> wrote:
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Uh, no, ICE is currently arresting and deporting non-American =
born
>>>>>>>> spouses of US citizens.  Along with naturalized non-American =
born
>>>>>>>> citizens.  And Hispanics or those who just look like they might =
be
>>>>>>>> Hispanic regardless of citizenship.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Wow - 60 years ago that could have been my mother (who was from
>>>>>>> Vancouver, my father from the border town nearest the Canada-US =
border
>>>>>>> 30 miles south of Vancouver on the US side)
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Of course English was her first language so in the present =
environment
>>>>>>> that might be a plus.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> 	As long as she did not tan very dark she might be safe.
>>>>>> But with the present administration make sure you have your
>>>>>> citizenship documents.
>>>>>
>>>>> Citizenship documents? I now have to carry around my birth
>>>>> certificate? Would it even be accepted, since RealID was not in at
>>>>> least one reported case?
>>>>>
>>>>> Everybody understands that having to "show your papers" when =
demanded
>>>>> for any or no reason (as opposed to a reasonable cause request) is =
a
>>>>> hallmark of, if not totalitarianism, then at least a police state,
>>>>> right?
>>>>>
>>>>> And, anyway, if the Orange Taco reallly /has/ compiled a list of =
all
>>>>> US Citizens, his minions can use their cell phones to look me up =
from
>>>>> my (ordinary) driver's licence and see for themselves that I am on =
the
>>>>> list.
>>>>>
>>>>> If he's going to compile such a list, we need to demand that his
>>>>> minions /use/ the list and treat it as authoritative.
>>>>
>>>> Generally when my parents (and infant me) lived in the US she just
>>>> carried her US social security card - as did my father in Canada
>>>> before his naturalization. Both of them had drivers' licences and =
the
>>>> usual range of common documents.
>>>>
>>>> After she was permanently in Canada, the only time she ever had dark
>>>> skin was immediately after spending 6 weeks in southern California
>>>> during her vacations or when attending the Tucson gem show (we were =
in
>>>> the jeweller's tool business). She did have black hair but I've =
never
>>>> had anyone think she was Hispanic (though she did die in AZ after
>>>> being run over by a runaway motor vehicle in a parking lot).
>>>>
>>>> I would be surprised to be thought Hispanic nor would my brother.
>>>
>>> 	That last is a confusing sentence and likely you would not be =
thought
>>> of as Hispanic-American but the ICE is like insane.  They violate the=
 law in
>>> seizing any immigrant even those with US Green Cards and Permanent
>>> Resident status.  They tossed a Canadian in jail for over 2 weeks.
>>>
>>> 	Stephen Miller has set the ICE a quota and they are not too careful
>>> about how they fill it.
>>=20
>> And yet the latest report I have read had Trump deporting /fewer
>> people/ each month than Obama. A lot fewer.
>>=20
>> An earlier report made the same point about Biden.
>>=20
>> As you note and I have noted and an article I read online has noted,
>> the problem is the /sloppiness/ of the effort.
>>=20
>> Let me be clear on this: if the law is wrong, it must be changed, not
>> ignored. Anyone opposing ICE because they are enforcing the law is
>> wrong. Anyone opposing ICE because of the /way/ they are doing it is
>> right on.
>>=20
>> And keep in mind that it is often not the worker bees who require the
>> bad behavior. It is often their supervisors, a chain that leads all
>> the way up to Trump. Who, as President, is responsible for everything
>> the Federal Government (civilian and military) does.
>
>	I just saw today a report on the arrest by ICE of a young man of a =
brown
>complexion who had his military papers with him and was pulled out of =
his
>car and held for several days.  He had served in wartime overseas and =
why
>should he be subject to this unwarranted detenion.

Because he "looked like a Mexican". That's the only apparent
criterion.

And the facts don't matter. To Trump, that is.
--=20
"Here lies the Tuscan poet Aretino,
Who evil spoke of everyone but God,
Giving as his excuse, 'I never knew him.'"