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From: The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid>
Newsgroups: comp.os.linux.misc
Subject: Re: F2FS On USB Sticks?
Date: Tue, 25 Mar 2025 11:13:30 +0000
Organization: A little, after lunch
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On 25/03/2025 05:18, c186282 wrote:
> On 3/24/25 7:31 AM, The Natural Philosopher wrote:
>> On 23/03/2025 10:05, c186282 wrote:
>>> On 3/22/25 8:52 PM, The Natural Philosopher wrote:
>>>> On 22/03/2025 19:09, rbowman wrote:
>>>>> On Sat, 22 Mar 2025 13:35:54 +0000, The Natural Philosopher wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>> The PICO has no filesystem. IN use you hold a button down while 
>>>>>> powering
>>>>>> up and it's Flash presents itself as a USB drive. You copy a special
>>>>>> binary file of compiled code onto that 'drive', and it reboots and 
>>>>>> runs
>>>>>> it..
>>>>>
>>>>> Okay, you hold down BOOTSEL when plugging it into the USB. Then it 
>>>>> shows
>>>>> up on Files as RP2350.  If you click on that you see INDEX.HTM and
>>>>> INFO_UF2.TXT. If you look at Properties it reports 2 items totaling 
>>>>> 305
>>>>> bytes and 134.1 MB free.
>>>>>
>>>>> df -Th /dev/sda1
>>>>> Filesystem     Type  Size  Used Avail Use% Mounted on
>>>>> /dev/sda1      vfat  128M  8.0K  128M   1% /media/xxxxx/RP2350
>>>>>
>>>>> Then you can
>>>>>
>>>>> cp blink.uf2 /media/xxxxx/RP2350/
>>>>>
>>>>> and, lo and behold, it starts blinking and vanishes from the file 
>>>>> system!
>>>>> I'm lazy so after it blinks 20 times it calls
>>>>>
>>>>> reset_usb_boot(0, 0);
>>>>>
>>>>> and miraculously reappears mounted.  How does it do all this without a
>>>>> file system known to Ubuntu? I won't even ask why after copying the
>>>>> CircuitPython uf2 it reboots mounted as CIRCUITPYTHON and you can 
>>>>> copy .py
>>>>> files directly.
>>>>>
>>>>> My comment had nothing to do with the programmatic use of the flash
>>>>> memory, only how the Pico presents as a mass storage device.
>>>>
>>>> Well it spoofs the disk obviously
>>>
>>>    Ya know ..... think I'm gonna stay away from Pico's  :-)
>>>
>> It is a big learning curve. But they are fearfully cheap...small...and 
>> light
>>
>>>    If I want microcontrollers, there are more traditional
>>>    straight-up boards out there. If I want microprocessors
>>>    there are the straight-up PIs and beyond.
>>>
>>>    Did use PICs for a long time ... kinda remember their
>>>    quirks and tricks. There are Pico/Nano style boards to
>>>    be had cheap that use PICs. Atmel versions also exist.
>>
>> I looked at those. Many times the price of a pico.
>>
>> I am slowly making up libraries of Code That Works (as opposed to what 
>> you find plastered around the Web.
> 
>    As I was talking about elsewhere, there's the price
>    of the target CHIPS, and then the price of the
>    development system/board. The price of the latter
>    has become rather high in some cases ... can't even
>    get a good all-purpose PIC programmer anymore that
>    doesn't require special sockets/libs and such for $$$
> 
?. Picos don't need development boards, I mean what are you going to 
hang round them that is so complex? I just go straight to the final PCB.

Works out at maybe $20 for 10 chinese made PCBs...


>    MicroChip USED to sell a very useful serial appliance
>    with a 40-pin ZIF socket. Upgraded it once. You could
>    stick a large variety of their chips into the thing.
>    Just specify in their dev app and it'd all work well.
> 
>    But now .........
> 
>    If you are an 'experimenter' or small-run person then
>    the price of the dev/programming crap kinda now makes
>    it just TOO.
> 

?/ What???  The point about a PICO is that it *is* a development board, 
if you like, It's all in for $5.
All youi need is s computer running a GCC cross compiler and the free 
development envir9nmenmt


>    Found people long back who sold an upgraded 8051 (it
>    was 'fat', had an actual battery in the case to keep
>    the RAM alive) AND a BASIC-like compiler. The programmer
>    was a small, kinda bare, PC board - again serial interface.
>    Not fancy at all - but GOT IT DONE. Made dozens of devices
>    using that all for almost nothing.
> 
>    Oh, if a MHz or so is enough, the 8051 is STILL a great chip.
> 
That must have been 50 years ago., Things have moved on

>    In any case, I *understand* the Pico/Nano approach. It's
>    "all in one" and no vast other investment required. As
>    for whether they're good/easy for EVERYTHING, well ....
>    actually ARDs are still competitive, esp for low-power
>    applications. Sleep the thing and wait for the next
>    interrupt ........
> 
PICOS essentially the same. Or what I am looking to do is to use an 
external  ultra low power timer to switch the board on after a long 
delay, and the board switches  itself off when its done its business. 
Rinse and repeat



-- 
The urge to save humanity is almost always a false front for the urge to 
rule.
– H. L. Mencken, American journalist, 1880-1956