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From: olcott <polcott333@gmail.com>
Newsgroups: comp.theory
Subject: Re: DDD specifies recursive emulation to HHH and halting to HHH1
Date: Sun, 30 Mar 2025 16:56:37 -0500
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On 3/30/2025 4:05 PM, Richard Damon wrote:
> On 3/30/25 4:32 PM, olcott wrote:
>> On 3/30/2025 1:52 PM, Richard Damon wrote:
>>> On 3/30/25 2:27 PM, olcott wrote:
>>>> On 3/30/2025 3:12 AM, joes wrote:
>>>>> Am Sat, 29 Mar 2025 16:46:26 -0500 schrieb olcott:
>>>>>> On 3/29/2025 3:14 PM, dbush wrote:
>>>>>>> On 3/29/2025 4:01 PM, olcott wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>>>> We can know that when this adapted UTM simulates a finite number of
>>>>>>>> steps of its input that this finite number of steps were simulated
>>>>>>>> correctly.
>>>>>>> And therefore does not do a correct UTM simulation that matches the
>>>>>>> behavior of the direct execution as it is incomplete.
>>>>>> It is dishonest to expect non-terminating inputs to complete.
>>>>> A complete simulation of a nonterminating input doesn't halt.
>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> 2) changing the input is not allowed
>>>>>>>> The input is unchanged. There never was any indication that the 
>>>>>>>> input
>>>>>>>> was in any way changed.
>>>>>>> False, if the starting function calls UTM and UTM changes, you're
>>>>>>> changing the input.
>>>>>> When UTM1 is a UTM that has been adapted to only simulate a finite
>>>>>> number of steps
>>>>> So not an UTM.
>>>>>
>>>>>> and input D calls UTM1 then the behavior of D simulated
>>>>>> by UTM1 never reaches its final halt state.
>>>>>> When D is simulated by ordinary UTM2 that D does not call Then D 
>>>>>> reaches
>>>>>> its final halt state.
>>>>> Doesn't matter if it calls it, but if the UTM halts.
>>>>>
>>>>>>> Changing the input is not allowed.
>>>>>> I never changed the input. D always calls UTM1.
>>>>>> thus is the same input to UTM1 as it is to UTM2.
>>>>> You changed UTM1, which is part of the input D.
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>> UTM1 simulates D that calls UTM1
>>>> simulated D NEVER reaches final halt state
>>>>
>>>> UTM2 simulates D that calls UTM1
>>>> simulated D ALWAYS reaches final halt state
>>>>
>>>
>>> Only because UTM1 isn't actually a UTM, but a LIE since it only does 
>>> a partial simulation, not a complete as REQURIED by the definition of 
>>> a UTM.
>>>
>>
>> _DDD()
>> [00002172] 55         push ebp      ; housekeeping
>> [00002173] 8bec       mov  ebp,esp  ; housekeeping
>> [00002175] 6872210000 push 00002172 ; push DDD
>> [0000217a] e853f4ffff call 000015d2 ; call HHH(DDD)
>> [0000217f] 83c404     add  esp,+04
>> [00002182] 5d         pop  ebp
>> [00002183] c3         ret
>> Size in bytes:(0018) [00002183]
>>
>> DDD EMULATED BY HHH DOES SPECIFY THAT IT
>> CANNOT POSSIBLY REACH ITS OWN FINAL HALT STATE.
>>
>> THAT IS WHAT IT SAYS AND ANYONE THAT DISAGREES
>> IS A DAMNED LIAR OR STUPID.
>>
> 
> How is that DDD correctly emulated beyond the call HHH instruction by a 
> program that is a pure function, and thus only looks at its input?
>

*THE ENTIRE SCOPE IS*
DDD EMULATED BY HHH DOES SPECIFY THAT IT
CANNOT POSSIBLY REACH ITS OWN FINAL HALT STATE.

If HHH determines this entirely from a psychotic
break from reality the above sentence remains
immutably true.

-- 
Copyright 2025 Olcott "Talent hits a target no one else can hit; Genius
hits a target no one else can see." Arthur Schopenhauer