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Path: ...!eternal-september.org!feeder3.eternal-september.org!news.eternal-september.org!eternal-september.org!.POSTED!not-for-mail From: olcott <polcott333@gmail.com> Newsgroups: comp.theory Subject: Re: DDD specifies recursive emulation to HHH and halting to HHH1 --- STA Date: Wed, 2 Apr 2025 21:15:55 -0500 Organization: A noiseless patient Spider Lines: 40 Message-ID: <vskr0r$378kj$8@dont-email.me> References: <vrfuob$256og$1@dont-email.me> <vsbi7e$1hblk$1@dont-email.me> <vsc6qi$27lbo$2@dont-email.me> <8a3e7e93e6cad20b29d23405a0e6dbd497a492ac@i2pn2.org> <vscegq$2fv3s$2@dont-email.me> <26f33bb039fda7d28ae164cfc4d0f582d4698f31@i2pn2.org> <vsclsb$2n4jc$1@dont-email.me> <36a4c76730b23cf78ddde73c723116b5380973a1@i2pn2.org> <vsctnm$2ub5m$2@dont-email.me> <4285ea3219a2d5f2d6c52e84697fa4e3d3dc80cb@i2pn2.org> <vsd18m$379dn$1@dont-email.me> <vsdjff$3o5ff$1@dont-email.me> <vsem50$th5g$3@dont-email.me> <77c20f5832db4b47f5226dcb39bd2be7ba107a0c@i2pn2.org> <vsf8tv$1i673$2@dont-email.me> <5cb726749c8a7457af5da692f77c6a04bc0c7401@i2pn2.org> <vsfdqb$1m8qr$2@dont-email.me> <733db53c4b67cf1fbbd45fdf503b1d27539b7414@i2pn2.org> <vsfigf$1r8rb$2@dont-email.me> <bf1e010d6259a4e5e1118f51856f3c72a0094b34@i2pn2.org> <vsht8v$90ss$6@dont-email.me> <524b81bf3658a42bcba56f807fce28bfea67d36f@i2pn2.org> <vsi7tk$jd38$4@dont-email.me> <0b211b499961466f2b6a69af2f9a337c9f59bf9b@i2pn2.org> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Injection-Date: Thu, 03 Apr 2025 04:15:56 +0200 (CEST) Injection-Info: dont-email.me; posting-host="3670ccff229fdc0c136848dacf82765a"; logging-data="3383955"; mail-complaints-to="abuse@eternal-september.org"; posting-account="U2FsdGVkX1/mgQAvFLP8aNYPNNw1ppun" User-Agent: Mozilla Thunderbird Cancel-Lock: sha1:29l13DzydB+wEKalrCtvYCbdtjk= Content-Language: en-US X-Antivirus-Status: Clean In-Reply-To: <0b211b499961466f2b6a69af2f9a337c9f59bf9b@i2pn2.org> X-Antivirus: Norton (VPS 250402-4, 4/2/2025), Outbound message Bytes: 3698 On 4/2/2025 8:52 AM, joes wrote: > Am Tue, 01 Apr 2025 21:37:40 -0500 schrieb olcott: >> On 4/1/2025 8:13 PM, Richard Damon wrote: >>> On 4/1/25 7:35 PM, olcott wrote: >>>> On 4/1/2025 5:36 AM, Richard Damon wrote: >>>>> On 3/31/25 10:19 PM, olcott wrote: > >>>>> But DDD doesn't prevent its own terminatation, as it calls an HHH >>>>> that WILL abort its emulation and return and answer. >>>>> >>>> You know that DDD stopping running and DDD reaching its final halt >>>> state are not the same thing you damned liar. >>>> >>> Right, the DDD who's simulation is stopped hasn't shown non-halting >>> behavior, just not-yet-halted. >>> >> You already admitted that you are lying about this. >> DDD emulated by HHH for an infinite number of steps never reaches its >> final halt state. > *finite > >> HHH sees this in one recursive emulation of DDD. >> >> *Simulating termination analyzer Principle* >> It is always correct for any simulating termination analyzer to stop >> simulating and reject any input that would otherwise prevent its own >> termination. The only rebuttal to this is rejecting the notion that >> deciders must always halt. > It must also return the right value. > By process of elimination and by the above criteria we can determine that not stopping the emulation causes HHH to never halt. This only leaves stopping the emulation that semantically entails that the input must be rejected. -- Copyright 2025 Olcott "Talent hits a target no one else can hit; Genius hits a target no one else can see." Arthur Schopenhauer