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From: dbush <dbush.mobile@gmail.com>
Newsgroups: comp.theory
Subject: Re: DDD simulated by HHH cannot possibly halt (Halting Problem)
Date: Sun, 13 Apr 2025 17:04:59 -0400
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On 4/13/2025 5:02 PM, olcott wrote:
> On 4/13/2025 2:54 PM, dbush wrote:
>> On 4/13/2025 3:52 PM, olcott wrote:
>>> On 4/13/2025 4:18 AM, joes wrote:
>>>> Am Wed, 09 Apr 2025 15:35:30 -0500 schrieb olcott:
>>>>> On 4/9/2025 1:58 PM, Fred. Zwarts wrote:
>>>>>> Op 09.apr.2025 om 19:29 schreef olcott:
>>>>>>> On 4/8/2025 10:31 AM, Fred. Zwarts wrote:
>>>>>>>> Op 08.apr.2025 om 17:13 schreef olcott:
>>>>>>>>> On 4/8/2025 2:45 AM, Fred. Zwarts wrote:
>>>>>>>>>> Op 08.apr.2025 om 06:33 schreef olcott:
>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> *Simulating termination analyzer Principle*
>>>>>>>>>>> It is always correct for any simulating termination analyzer to
>>>>>>>>>>> stop simulating and reject any input that would otherwise 
>>>>>>>>>>> prevent
>>>>>>>>>>> its own termination.
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> In this case there is nothing to prevent, because the finite 
>>>>>>>>>> string
>>>>>>>>>> specifies a program that halts.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> int DD()
>>>>>>>>> {
>>>>>>>>>     int Halt_Status = HHH(DD);
>>>>>>>>>     if (Halt_Status)
>>>>>>>>>       HERE: goto HERE;
>>>>>>>>>     return Halt_Status;
>>>>>>>>> }
>>>>>>>>> HHH(DD) meets the above: *Simulating termination analyzer 
>>>>>>>>> Principle*
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Everyone with a little bit of C knowledge understands that if HHH
>>>>>>>> returns with a value 0, then DDD halts.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> DDD CORRECTLY SIMULATED BY HHH NOT ANY OTHER DAMN DDD IN THE 
>>>>>>> UNIVERSE
>>>>>>> NITWIT.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>> If HHH would correctly simulate DD (and the functions called by DD)
>>>>>> then the simulated HHH would return to DD and DD would halt.
>>>>>> But HHH failed to complete the simulation of the halting program,
>>>>>
>>>>> HHH is only required to report on the behavior of its own correct
>>>>> simulation (meaning the according to the semantics of the C 
>>>>> programming
>>>>> language) and would be incorrect to report on any other behavior.
>>>
>>>> Such as what actually happens when you run it?
>>>>
>>>
>>> Why do you insist on dishonestly ignoring the pathological
>>> self-reference difference?
>>>
>>
>> Why do you insist on dishonestly ignoring that the input to HHH halts 
>> when executed directly?
> 
> Because this stupidly ignores the difference
> of pathological self-reference.
> 

But I want to know if any arbitrary algorithm X with input Y will halt 
when executed directly.  If I had an H that could tell me that in *all* 
possible cases, I could show that all truths are provable.

If you're not interested in such an H, then you have no interest in 
making all true statements provable.