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From: Don Y <blockedofcourse@foo.invalid>
Newsgroups: sci.electronics.design
Subject: Re: energy in UK
Date: Sun, 20 Apr 2025 10:25:36 -0700
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On 4/20/2025 7:27 AM, Martin Brown wrote:
>> E.g., the house I grew up in had two wire (neutral and hot) circuits
>> throughout, using BX cable.  So, none of the outlets had earth
>> connections available.
> 
> The code requirement for an earthed system goes way back in the UK. I can't 

The *system* is earthed but the outlets don't present a separate
earth conductor.  House was built in ~1956.

I recall adding branch circuits in the basement "work room" that
added the third conductor (load center was located in the basement
work room so little cost to use new cable, there)

> recall how far back but pre-WWII. My second year college room had old 3 pin 
> round sockets in and they were already rare in the 1980's.
> 
> BS546 was published in 1934 and quickly adopted. Prior to that every regional 
> electric company had their own random shaped plug & sockets. The odd one even 
> supplied DC! BS1363 was introduced just post war 1947.

I can recall working on homes (uncles were electricians) as a kid that
were wired with knob & tube, asphalt soaked tape, etc.

> That is essentially the same rectangular fused plug that we use today. Modern 
> ones are much less well made with less conductor than the old ones. 13A plugs 
> have been officially derated to 10A now.
> 
>>> Most UK ring main sockets *require* an earth pin to be present on the mains 
>>> plug to open the mechanical cover over the live and neutral terminals. It 
>>> was not always so. Previous round pin plugs you could poke a piece of metal 
>>> or screwdriver in there and touch live!
>>
>> Outlets (here), now have similar shutters to prevent entry of "unintended
>> conductors".  But, again, there is no requirement to retrofit them.
>> Ditto GFCIs, AFCIs, etc.
>>
>>>> What happens if a drunk takes down a "power pole" feeding said village?
>>>
>>> Last time it happened was the coldest day of the year and it was the milk 
>>> tanker hit black ice and took down 2 poles and 30' of hedge. There is no way 
>>> he was doing 30mph! Engineers had us back on by nightfall.
>>
>> Would he have been financially responsible for the repair (though
>> likely not the secondary losses)?
> 
> His insurers would be. Having insurance to drive on public roads is a strict 
> requirement in the UK and relatively well policed by ANPR.

Well, *he* would be named in the lawsuit and his insurer would step in
for his "defense".

But, that's just to "buy the light pole" (a euphemism here for the act of
crashing into a utility pole, usually while intoxicated).  Would he
also be liable for losses incurred by customers of the utility?
E.g., the local restaurateur suing because he lost a freezer full of food?
Or, would it be seen as an expected risk (power outage) that the
restaurateur should have protected against?