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From: zen cycle <funkmasterxx@hotmail.com>
Newsgroups: rec.bicycles.tech
Subject: Re: silca and Tariffs
Date: Sun, 27 Apr 2025 13:29:14 -0400
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On 4/27/2025 12:16 PM, Roger Merriman wrote:
> AMuzi <am@yellowjersey.org> wrote:
>> On 4/27/2025 9:15 AM, Roger Merriman wrote:
>>> John B. <slocombjb@gmail.com> wrote:
>>>> On Sun, 27 Apr 2025 04:47:34 -0400, Catrike Ryder
>>>> <Soloman@old.bikers.org> wrote:
>>>>
>>>>> On Sun, 27 Apr 2025 07:40:05 +0700, John B. <slocombjb@gmail.com>
>>>>> wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>> On Sat, 26 Apr 2025 14:33:53 -0500, AMuzi <am@yellowjersey.org> wrote:
>>>>>>
>>>>>>> On 4/26/2025 1:15 PM, cyclintom wrote:
>>>>>>>> On Sat Apr 26 13:41:16 2025 Catrike Ryder  wrote:
>>>>>>>>> On 26 Apr 2025 09:14:12 GMT, Roger Merriman <roger@sarlet.com> wrote:
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> <https://youtu.be/VKz5J5PPt-Q?si=ntPrbZPhCguTIuQM>
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> Josh of Silca does a good job of explaining how the tariffs are effecting
>>>>>>>>>> US companies certainly small ones, as ever it?s a moving target so may well
>>>>>>>>>> change.
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> Roger Merriman
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> Many countries have tariffs on products from the USA. I see no reason
>>>>>>>>> why the USA shouldn't have tariffs on their products. Maybe it will
>>>>>>>>> bring manufacturing back, maybe not. The USA used to be a
>>>>>>>>> manufacturing powerhouse and the bureaucratic jackasses let it slip
>>>>>>>>> away. I don't know if Trump's plans can save the country, but it was
>>>>>>>>> definatly going to hell with the same old, same old plans. At least
>>>>>>>>> he's trying something new.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> According to the Democrats tarriffws are good for other countries but
>>>>>>>> not for Ameriucs. It was perfectly OK for Clinton to apply larger
>>>>>>>> tarrifs to foreign goods than TGrump is doing but perfectly awful for
>>>>>>>> Trump to do titfor tat..
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Time to put these people away.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> You do not understand the problem.  Duty disparities are
>>>>>>> broad, deep, convoluted and often at multiple cross
>>>>>>> purposes. Oh, and they span every administration since
>>>>>>> nearly forever.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> All that applies in spades to domestic micromanagement in
>>>>>>> targeted areas in this and every country, what with
>>>>>>> incentives (bribes) and disincentives (punishment) of a
>>>>>>> hundred flavors in thousand of iterations.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Small example-
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> United States of America is written in Japanese as Beikoku:
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> https://www.pngegg.com/en/png-fnrij
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> or "rice" + "country", as the reformation of language in the
>>>>>>> 1860s was contemporaneous with plentiful and inexpensive
>>>>>>> American rice imports.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> That was long, long ago, before nearly all Japanese
>>>>>>> administrations encouraged (subsidized)  extremely small
>>>>>>> inefficient farms. Along with the votes of farmers, whose
>>>>>>> numbers would decrease if farms were combined into larger
>>>>>>> fields. (this is happening in USA now, a continuance of a
>>>>>>> long trend, with more food production from less labor, but a
>>>>>>> side effect is decreased farmer votes. In some counties this
>>>>>>> has had major political effect.)
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> https://ap.fftc.org.tw/article/1327
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> And don't think we're better. Review USA sugar subsidies,
>>>>>>> price supports and duties which are no better than policies
>>>>>>> for rice in Japan.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Or the Harley Tax. Or the Chicken Tax.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> I have been an importer of tubular bicycle tires across a
>>>>>>> half dozen entities, including Yellow Jersey, for over 50
>>>>>>> years. That's a product we have not made here in USA since
>>>>>>> before The Great Pacific War.  I pay import duty on each and
>>>>>>> every tire and the rate hasn't changed, up or down, in a
>>>>>>> half century.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Ah but... what would be the cost of setting up a factory and
>>>>>> manufacturing bike tires in the  U.S.? Is it possible for the U.S. to
>>>>>> compete with foreign bicycle tire makers?
>>>>>
>>>>> I suspect that building a bicycle tire factory costs less then the
>>>>> building an automobile factory and auto manufacturers have been moving
>>>>> their factories around for years.
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> True and usually for very good reasons, cost of operations. Normal
>>>> minimum salary in Mexico were a number of car factories have recently
>>>> open is US $2.04/hour while in the U.S. it is $7.25/hour.
>>>
>>> It’s also where the skilled labour plus equipment is, such as Silca
>>> couldn’t find a motor or battery of the right specifications at certainly
>>> not at a economic cost, I believe some us Military drone manufacturers
>>> motors could be bought but would result in cost well above the market for
>>> such things.
>>>
>>> Ie manufacturing takes decades to transfer from countries.
>>>
>>> Roger Merriman
>>>
>>
>> Or not.
>>
>> Bicycle assembly plants magically appeared in Cambodia a few
>> years ago (QC, fit & finish, packing all top quality IMHO)
>> and are now leaving.
>>
>> See also Apple in India.
>>
> 
> Assembly is rather less skilled labour than say making Carbon frames or
> other construction of parts, and India has like China been growing its
> manufacturing base over many decades, Apple among other phone manufacturers
> have there supply chain heavily dependent on China hence they needed a
> exemption, even if they also have assembly lines in India.
> 
> Roger Merriman
> 

  +1

Moving assembly facilities is a far cry from moving facilities where the 
raw materials are processed. In the context of the self-inflicted US 
tariff war, moving an assembly factory to the US would offer little 
benefit unless the parts are exempted from tariffs. The added labor 
costs would offset any savings in the tariff on the finished product. 
Sure, automation would be of some help to offset labor costs, but then 
you have the cost of building and maintaining the robotics, which 
themselves would be subject to tariffs.