Deutsch   English   Français   Italiano  
<vvj8ev$25s8h$1@dont-email.me>

View for Bookmarking (what is this?)
Look up another Usenet article

Path: ...!eternal-september.org!feeder3.eternal-september.org!news.eternal-september.org!eternal-september.org!.POSTED!not-for-mail
From: olcott <polcott333@gmail.com>
Newsgroups: comp.theory
Subject: Re: Incorrect requirements --- Computing the mapping from the input
 to HHH(DD)
Date: Thu, 8 May 2025 16:41:51 -0500
Organization: A noiseless patient Spider
Lines: 64
Message-ID: <vvj8ev$25s8h$1@dont-email.me>
References: <vv97ft$3fg66$1@dont-email.me> <vvdcld$3arjo$1@dont-email.me>
 <vvg6r9$15e69$1@dont-email.me> <vvg7uu$158tp$4@dont-email.me>
 <vvg8tk$15e69$4@dont-email.me> <vvgai8$158tp$6@dont-email.me>
 <vvgcme$15e69$9@dont-email.me> <vvgjdo$18i6e$2@dont-email.me>
 <vvgkao$18q46$1@dont-email.me> <vvgkd7$15i5e$23@dont-email.me>
 <vvgkum$18q46$3@dont-email.me> <vvgleo$15i5e$24@dont-email.me>
 <vvgov4$1a47o$2@dont-email.me> <vvgp8b$15i5e$25@dont-email.me>
 <vvgpk6$1a47o$4@dont-email.me> <vvgpo7$15i5e$26@dont-email.me>
 <vvgq6o$1acph$1@dont-email.me> <vvgqgl$15i5e$27@dont-email.me>
 <vvgr22$1ag3a$2@dont-email.me> <vvgt36$1auqp$2@dont-email.me>
 <vvgtbe$1b0li$1@dont-email.me> <vvguot$1auqp$3@dont-email.me>
 <vvh0t2$1b939$1@dont-email.me> <vvhap5$1hp80$1@dont-email.me>
 <vvhf20$1ihs9$1@dont-email.me> <vvhfnd$1hvei$3@dont-email.me>
 <vvil99$1ugd5$1@dont-email.me> <vvinvp$1vglb$1@dont-email.me>
 <vviv75$222r6$1@dont-email.me> <vvj1fp$22a62$1@dont-email.me>
 <vvj2j6$23gk7$1@dont-email.me>
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8; format=flowed
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit
Injection-Date: Thu, 08 May 2025 23:41:51 +0200 (CEST)
Injection-Info: dont-email.me; posting-host="f36da193996cadd52a214445b52881fc";
	logging-data="2289937"; mail-complaints-to="abuse@eternal-september.org";	posting-account="U2FsdGVkX1/SrUSRL+UWQjmL9fQctJcv"
User-Agent: Mozilla Thunderbird
Cancel-Lock: sha1:PrjWin7i1TdLd3o74bkTScxetOA=
X-Antivirus: Norton (VPS 250508-4, 5/8/2025), Outbound message
Content-Language: en-US
X-Antivirus-Status: Clean
In-Reply-To: <vvj2j6$23gk7$1@dont-email.me>
Bytes: 4233

On 5/8/2025 3:01 PM, Richard Heathfield wrote:
> On 08/05/2025 20:42, olcott wrote:
>> On 5/8/2025 2:04 PM, Fred. Zwarts wrote:
>>> Op 08.mei.2025 om 19:00 schreef olcott:>>>>
>>>> int DD()
>>>> {
>>>>    int Halt_Status = HHH(DD);
>>>>    if (Halt_Status)
>>>>      HERE: goto HERE;
>>>>    return Halt_Status;
>>>> }
>>>>
>>>> The key gist of the issue (no weeds involved)
>>>> is that HHH emulated DD according to the rules
>>>> of the x86 language
>>>>
>>>> <MIT Professor Sipser agreed to ONLY these verbatim words 10/13/2022>
>>>>      *until H correctly determines that*
>>>>      *its simulated D would never stop running unless aborted*
>>>> </MIT Professor Sipser agreed to ONLY these verbatim words 10/13/2022>
>>>
>>> And since H does not correctly determine that its simulated D would 
>>> never stop running unless aborted, it is a vacuous statement and 
>>> Sipser's agreement does not tell anything.
>>>
>>
>> That is counter factual as any fully qualified
>> C programmer will tell you.
> 
> As any competent C programmer can tell you, your simulation is driven by 
> assembly language, not C. Furthermore, neither halt7.c nor x86utm.cpp is 
> syntactically correct C. Once you fix the syntax errors, that still 
> leaves you with the undefined behaviour.
> 
> Getting it right is tedious.
> 

void DDD()
{
   HHH(DDD);
   return;
}

What my code actually does is totally irrelevant.
The relevant point is that no function that
unconditionally calls its own simulator can possibly
reach its own final state.

_DDD()
[00002172] 55         push ebp      ; housekeeping
[00002173] 8bec       mov ebp,esp   ; housekeeping
[00002175] 6872210000 push 00002172 ; push DDD
[0000217a] e853f4ffff call 000015d2 ; call HHH(DDD)
[0000217f] 83c404     add esp,+04
[00002182] 5d         pop ebp
[00002183] c3         ret
Size in bytes:(0018) [00002183]

The exact same thing goes for any function
that calls its own emulator.

-- 
Copyright 2024 Olcott "Talent hits a target no one else can hit; Genius
hits a target no one else can see." Arthur Schopenhauer