Path: ...!eternal-september.org!feeder2.eternal-september.org!i2pn.org!i2pn2.org!.POSTED!not-for-mail From: Richard Damon Newsgroups: comp.theory Subject: Re: The philosophy of computation reformulates existing ideas on a new basis --- Date: Tue, 29 Oct 2024 21:17:39 -0400 Organization: i2pn2 (i2pn.org) Message-ID: References: <1bc1ab08ec47bf818ddff1d4f63b542ceadd6985@i2pn2.org> <086fc32f14bcc004466d3128b0fe585b27377399@i2pn2.org> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Injection-Date: Wed, 30 Oct 2024 01:17:39 -0000 (UTC) Injection-Info: i2pn2.org; logging-data="78400"; mail-complaints-to="usenet@i2pn2.org" User-Agent: Mozilla Thunderbird Content-Language: en-US In-Reply-To: Bytes: 4280 Lines: 63 On 10/29/24 10:41 AM, olcott wrote: > On 10/29/2024 5:50 AM, Richard Damon wrote: >> On 10/28/24 11:08 PM, olcott wrote: >>> On 10/28/2024 9:56 PM, Richard Damon wrote: >>>> On 10/28/24 9:09 PM, olcott wrote: >>>>> On 10/28/2024 6:56 PM, Richard Damon wrote: >>>>>> >>>>>> It is IMPOSSIBLE to emulate DDD per the x86 semantics without the >>>>>> code for HHH, so it needs to be part of the input. >>>>>> >>>>> >>>>> *You seemed to be a totally Jackass here* >>>>> You are not that stupid >>>>> You are not that ignorant >>>>> and this is not your ADD >>>>> >>>>> _DDD() >>>>> [00002172] 55         push ebp      ; housekeeping >>>>> [00002173] 8bec       mov ebp,esp   ; housekeeping >>>>> [00002175] 6872210000 push 00002172 ; push DDD >>>>> [0000217a] e853f4ffff call 000015d2 ; call HHH(DDD) >>>>> [0000217f] 83c404     add esp,+04 >>>>> [00002182] 5d         pop ebp >>>>> [00002183] c3         ret >>>>> Size in bytes:(0018) [00002183] >>>>> >>>>> At machine address 0000217a HHH emulates itself emulating >>>>> DDD without knowing that it is emulating itself. >>>>> >>>> >>>> Then how did it convert the call HHH into an emulation of DDD again? >>>> >>> >>> When HHH (unknowingly) emulates itself emulating DDD this >>> emulated HHH is going to freaking emulate DDD. >>> >>> Did you think it was going to play poker? >>> >> >> Which is what it would do, get stuck and fail to be a decider. It >> might figure out that it is emulating an emulating decider, at which >> point it knows that the decider might choose to abort its conditional >> emulation to return, so it needs to emulate further. >> >> Only by recognizing itself, does it have grounds to say that if I >> don't abort, it never will, and thus I am stuck, so I need to abort. >> > > Counter-factual. This algorithm has no ability to its own code. > https://github.com/plolcott/x86utm/blob/master/Halt7.c // page 801 > > *That people fail to agree with this and also fail to* > *correctly point out any error seems to indicate dishonestly* > *or lack of technical competence* > > DDD emulated by HHH according to the semantics of the x86 > language cannot possibly reach its own "return" instruction > whether or not any HHH ever aborts its emulation of DDD. > No, it knows its own code because it rule for "No conditional branches" excludes that code. And thus it is working with an invalid arguement.