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From: MarkE <me22over7@gmail.com>
Newsgroups: talk.origins
Subject: Re: To sum up
Date: Wed, 19 Feb 2025 09:52:12 +1100
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On 19/02/2025 3:59 am, Martin Harran wrote:
> On Tue, 18 Feb 2025 21:41:42 +1100, MarkE <me22over7@gmail.com> wrote:
> 
>> On 18/02/2025 8:55 pm, Martin Harran wrote:
>>> On Tue, 18 Feb 2025 20:37:06 +1100, MarkE <me22over7@gmail.com> wrote:
>>>
>>>> On 18/02/2025 8:15 pm, Martin Harran wrote:
>>>>> The question I would like to see you address is how your Intelligent
>>>>> Designer might have gone about this.
>>>>>
>>>>> The human brain indeed has unique characteristics in terms of its
>>>>> ability and functions. Other species do not have those
>>>>> characteristics, but they do have similar brain structures and, as
>>>>> Ernest has pointed out in several examples, those brains can sometimes
>>>>> be argued to be even more complex than the human one. So how do you
>>>>> think your Intelligent Designer went about this? Did he play around
>>>>> with various prototype brain designs on other species and then come up
>>>>> with a particular design that he decided to give to humans alone?
>>>>
>>>> Why the hostile, mocking tone,
>>>
>>> Not meant to be either hostile or mocking but I accept it may come
>>> across that way due to my frustration with you continually refusing to
>>> deal with issues raided by a fellow religious believer. [1]
>>>
>>>> and straw man depiction of God?
>>>
>>> It is you and your fellow IDers who have created a strawman by
>>> pretending to talk about some anodyne designer when you really mean
>>> God; and not just *any* God, the specific Christian God.
>>
>> I'm with many ID proponents who are openly Christians, but in the
>> context of debating the interpretation and implications of scientific
>> evidence, deliberately and correctly refer only to a non-specific
>> intelligent designer interacting with this material world from outside
>> of spacetime.
> 
> Why do you feel the need to hide your religious beliefs; why not just
> come out and talk openly about God? That seems to me a lack of
> confidence in your religious beliefs or at least your ability to
> convince other people.

But I have and do. I've quoted the Bible, I've given a (speculative) 
outline of how God might have created, etc. Happy to be transparent 
about my personal belief.

But when talking about science identifying potential inadequacy of a 
naturalistic explanation, it is appropriate to posit a non-specific 
agency in that context.

I can see how this might construed as deceptive, but it's actually about 
  disciplined argument and avoiding category errors.


> 
>>
>>>
>>>
>>> ===========================
>>>
>>> [1] For example, still waiting for you to produce the evidence you
>>> promised 10 days ago about ID gaining traction.
>>>
>>
>> It'll come, I'm still doing midnighters. And distracting myself with
>> posts like these.
>