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Failed to connect to MySQL: (1203) User howardkn already has more than 'max_user_connections' active connectionsPath: ...!eternal-september.org!feeder3.eternal-september.org!news.eternal-september.org!eternal-september.org!.POSTED!not-for-mail From: Catrike Ryder Newsgroups: rec.bicycles.tech Subject: Re: Most significant advance in bike technology for speed? Date: Fri, 24 Jan 2025 19:06:53 -0500 Organization: A noiseless patient Spider Lines: 121 Message-ID: References: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Injection-Date: Sat, 25 Jan 2025 01:06:56 +0100 (CET) Injection-Info: dont-email.me; posting-host="9f0518eb57ccee5e117beede4f1c5b0b"; logging-data="2604904"; mail-complaints-to="abuse@eternal-september.org"; posting-account="U2FsdGVkX1/ZkYq+4sGQKa4xZuiBSnWXhpUa7NBmfxU=" User-Agent: ForteAgent/8.00.32.1272 Cancel-Lock: sha1:Nf9gpr0qpENPMCyKSc/aWhIUhgM= Bytes: 5745 On 24 Jan 2025 23:51:10 GMT, Roger Merriman wrote: >Zen Cycle wrote: >> On 1/24/2025 2:33 PM, Frank Krygowski wrote: >>> In another forum, someone postulated that integrated brake & shift >>> levers (like STI) were the most significant bit of racing technology >>> ever designed for increasing speed. But that claim met with little >>> respect. One skeptic noted that there was no great increase in average >>> race speeds in Paris-Roubaix, Milan-San Remo, Tour of Flanders, Leige- >>> Bastogne-Leige or Giro de Lobardia since about 1960, including during >>> the era of STI adoption. By contrast, in the  years 1930 - 1960 average >>> speeds increased around 30%. (Note: That does not mean that STI is not >>> tactically beneficial. That's a separate issue.) >> >> I'm going to take issue with this claim. The speeds have been showing a >> steady increase. "Great" increase is somewhat subjective, and taking >> into account the general "square-law effect" with going faster on a >> bicycle, a increase of 1MPH from 28 to 29 MPH could indeed be considered >> a "great" increase over going from 25 to 26 MPH. >> >> Granted, this has little to do with integrated shifting, my nit is over >> the claim "there was no great increase in average race speeds....since >> about 1960" >> >> >> from wikipedia, the top ten fastest editions of PAris-Roubaix were: >> >> Mathieu van der Poel (NED) 47.80 km/h (29.70 mph) 2024 >> Mathieu van der Poel (NED) 46.84 km/h (29.11 mph) 2023 >> Dylan van Baarle (NED) 45.79 km/h (28.45 mph) 2022 >> Greg Van Avermaet (BEL) 45.20 km/h (28.09 mph) 2017 >> Peter Post (NED) 45.13 km/h (28.04 mph) 1964 >> Fabian Cancellara (SUI) 44.19 km/h (27.46 mph) 2013 >> Rik Van Steenbergen (BEL) 43.99 km/h (27.33 mph) 1948 >> Mathew Hayman (AUS) 43.91 km/h (27.28 mph) 2016 >> Peter Sagan (SVK) 43.55 km/h (27.06 mph) 2018 >> Pino Cerami (BEL) 43.54 km/h (27.05 mph) 1960 >> >> Out of the top ten in the 100+ year history of the race, 6 are within >> the past ten years. I challenge anyone to argue against a 10% increase >> since Sagan in 2018 to VDP in 2024 as anything but a "great" increase. >> >> Milan/San Remo shows a similar trend. From >> https://www.procyclingstats.com/race/milano-sanremo/results/fastest-editions >> : >> >> Edition Year Avg. speed >> 115 2024 46.11 >> 114 2023 45.773 >> 113 2022 45.331 >> 97 2006 45.268 >> 112 2021 45.06 >> 100 2009 44.421 >> 98 2007 43.665 >> 110 2019 43.625 >> 104 2013 43.577 >> 102 2011 43.486 >> >> It certainly isn't due to drivetrain technology, I'll suggest the trend >> towards wider tires has a great deal to do with it, but more so training >> and diet technological advances. >> >> >Though it has ment that groupsets manufacturers do produce/provide for the >Pros some truly massive chain rings I don’t spin out 46/11 on the flat, and >gravity is my friend on the downs being on the heavy side! >>> >>> But if not STI, what were the most significant tech developments >>> regarding bicycle race speeds? >>> >>> Here’s my list: >>> >>> Pedals & cranks, as opposed to scooting a “hobby horse” via feet on the >>> ground. >>> >>> Tubular metal frames and wire tension (spoke) wheels. >>> >>> Large driven wheels, to give a much higher effective “gear.” (The >>> Ordinary or Penny Farthing) >>> >>> The “Safety Bicycle” with a diamond frame and chain drive, getting the >>> rider down lower, to greatly reduce aero drag as well as pitchover on >>> braking. >>> >>> Pneumatic tires. Hard tired “safeties” had terrible rolling resistance. >>> >>> The handlebar stem, invented by the heroic Major Taylor, to allow a much >>> more aero riding position. >>> >>> Rim brakes, by whatever mechanism, as opposed to spoon brakes acting on >>> a tire. >>> >>> Multiple gears, by whatever mechanism. >>> >>> The derailleur, making multiple gears easy to shift, customizable and >>> light weight. >>> >>> Recumbent geometry in some situations. Recumbents seem to be slower >>> uphill, but tend to be faster on level or downhills >>> >>> Fully enclosed streamlined aero shells tremendously increased speed, but >>> at a great reduction in versatility and practicality. >>> >>> Beyond those, ISTM that most developments have been chasing ever >>> diminishing returns. >>> >> >> >Roger Merriman > > 46 is massive? I have a 53, also with an 11.. Although I don't use that anymore except in a downhill. Granted that I have a 26 inch wheel. -- C'est bon Soloman