Path: ...!weretis.net!feeder9.news.weretis.net!news.nk.ca!rocksolid2!i2pn2.org!.POSTED!not-for-mail From: Richard Damon Newsgroups: comp.theory Subject: Re: Sufficient knowledge of C proves that DD specifies non-terminating behavior to HHH Date: Mon, 10 Feb 2025 07:37:15 -0500 Organization: i2pn2 (i2pn.org) Message-ID: <2f4f3ffdb308d743324591c52cbe9d73c7b28173@i2pn2.org> References: <228a9804d6919149bac728ccf08134ed90db121e@i2pn2.org> <6f15178eda69b13fae9cbfef29acad05c9c6aeb3@i2pn2.org> <1454e934b709b66a0cb9de9e9796cb46fed0425c@i2pn2.org> <274abb70abec9d461ac3eb34c0980b7421f5fabd@i2pn2.org> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Injection-Date: Mon, 10 Feb 2025 12:37:15 -0000 (UTC) Injection-Info: i2pn2.org; logging-data="3576491"; mail-complaints-to="usenet@i2pn2.org"; posting-account="diqKR1lalukngNWEqoq9/uFtbkm5U+w3w6FQ0yesrXg"; User-Agent: Mozilla Thunderbird X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 4.0.0 Content-Language: en-US In-Reply-To: Bytes: 5742 Lines: 82 On 2/10/25 7:02 AM, olcott wrote: > On 2/10/2025 5:16 AM, joes wrote: >> Am Sun, 09 Feb 2025 13:54:39 -0600 schrieb olcott: >>> On 2/9/2025 1:33 PM, Fred. Zwarts wrote: >>>> Op 09.feb.2025 om 20:04 schreef olcott: >>>>> On 2/9/2025 12:54 PM, Fred. Zwarts wrote: >>>>>> Op 09.feb.2025 om 18:00 schreef olcott: >>>>>>> On 2/9/2025 10:50 AM, Fred. Zwarts wrote: >>>>>>>> Op 09.feb.2025 om 16:18 schreef olcott: >>>>>>>>> On 2/9/2025 2:13 AM, Fred. Zwarts wrote: >>>>>>>>>> Op 09.feb.2025 om 07:10 schreef olcott: >>>>>>>>>>> On 2/8/2025 3:54 PM, Fred. Zwarts wrote: >>>>>>>>>>>> Op 08.feb.2025 om 15:47 schreef olcott: >>>>>>>>>>>>> On 2/8/2025 3:57 AM, Fred. Zwarts wrote: >>>>>>>>>>>>>> Op 08.feb.2025 om 06:53 schreef olcott: >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> On 2/7/2025 7:27 PM, Richard Damon wrote: >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> On 2/7/25 8:12 PM, olcott wrote: >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> On 2/7/2025 5:56 PM, Richard Damon wrote: >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> On 2/7/25 11:26 AM, olcott wrote: >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> On 2/7/2025 6:20 AM, Richard Damon wrote: >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> On 2/6/25 10:02 PM, olcott wrote: >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> On 2/6/2025 8:21 PM, Richard Damon wrote: >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> On 2/6/25 5:18 PM, olcott wrote: >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> On 2/6/2025 1:51 PM, Richard Damon wrote: >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> On 2/6/25 1:26 PM, olcott wrote: >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> On 2/6/2025 10:52 AM, Bonita Montero wrote: >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Am 05.02.2025 um 16:11 schrieb olcott: >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> On 2/5/2025 1:44 AM, Bonita Montero wrote: >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Am 05.02.2025 um 04:38 schrieb olcott: >> >>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>> Which proves that HHH fails to make a correct decision about >>>>>>>>>>>> DD's halting behaviour. All other methods (direct execution, >>>>>>>>>>>> simulation by a world class simulator, etc.) show that DD >>>>>>>>>>>> halts. But HHH fails to see it. Everyone with sufficient >>>>>>>>>>>> understanding of programming sees that HHH is not correctly >>>>>>>>>>>> programmed when it aborts one cycle before the simulation would >>>>>>>>>>>> end normally. >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> The execution trace only shows that HHH is unable to complete its >>>>>>>>>> simulation, because HHH is unable to simulate itself. >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> It turns out that Olcott does not even understand this simple proof >>>>>>>> that HHH produces false negatives. HHH is unable to simulate itself >>>>>>>> up to the normal termination. >>>>>>> >>>>>> So, in other words, Olcott denies verified facts. >>>>>> HHH generates false negatives, as is verified in >>>>>>          int main() { >>>>>>            return HHH(main); >>>>>>          } >>>>>> but he denies it. >>>>>> He lacks the ability to accept simple verified facts, which he tries >>>>>> to hide with a lot of irrelevant words. >>>>> >>>>> It is a verified fact that main cannot possibly be correctly simulated >>>>> by HHH until its normal termination. >>>> >>>> Indeed, which proves that HHH is unable to simulate itself correctly. >>> >>> If this was true then you could point out exactly where HHH is >>> incorrect. > >> HHH is supposed to be a decider, i.e. halt and return the correct value. >> > > The directly executed HHH(DD) always halts and returns a correct > value as soon as it correctly determines that its input cannot > possibly terminate normally. But that answer ISN'T "correct" becuase the input when run DOES terminate normally. Your problem is you just don't know what TRUTH is. You claim you need a link to the truth-makers but instead you build your links to your lies. > >>> Here is the code point out the (nonexistent) error: >> https://github.com/plolcott/x86utm/blob/master/Halt7.c#L502 >> > >