Path: ...!weretis.net!feeder8.news.weretis.net!fu-berlin.de!uni-berlin.de!individual.net!not-for-mail From: Thomas Heger Newsgroups: sci.physics.relativity,sci.physics,comp.os.linux.advocacy Subject: Re: Guess who? Date: Fri, 11 Apr 2025 07:27:35 +0200 Lines: 235 Message-ID: References: <67d1f9b7$0$29744$426a34cc@news.free.fr> <1raf38q.zd4rqrrx2js7N%nospam@de-ster.demon.nl> <1rainx9.9t7l9y16z2d8uN%nospam@de-ster.demon.nl> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Trace: individual.net pjKrTcDsivDtbFiUW/cjqgyLCU56mwuLNuDx9iDAPgb0RO69f4 Cancel-Lock: sha1:QyEG7CabuIhuQ3W3P8rcPLkZZ94= sha256:F1hMeljvd1Z3BZLc8M+za+Rf30EzilO/jZcKKFwjIzc= User-Agent: Mozilla Thunderbird Content-Language: de-DE In-Reply-To: Bytes: 10839 Am Donnerstag000010, 10.04.2025 um 19:46 schrieb x: > On 4/9/25 23:26, Thomas Heger wrote: > > Am Mittwoch000009, 09.04.2025 um 11:04 schrieb J. J. Lodder: > >> Thomas Heger wrote: > >> > >>> Am Montag000007, 07.04.2025 um 12:03 schrieb J. J. Lodder: > >>>> Physfitfreak wrote: > >>>> > >>>>> On 3/12/25 4:16 PM, J. J. Lodder wrote: > >>>>>> FYA, all. > >>>>>> Who wrote this letter, and for whom was it intended? > >>>>>> (ten bonus points for the correct year) > >>>>>> > >>>>>> ====== > >>>>>> Herr Einstein is one of the most original minds that we have ever > >>>>>> met. > >>>>>> In spite of his youth he already occupies a very honorable position > >>>>>> among the foremost savants of his time. > >>>>>> > >>>>>> What we marvel at him, above all, is the ease with which he adjusts > >>>>>> himself to new conceptions and draws all possible deductions from > >>>>>> them. > >>>>>> He does not cling to classic principles, but sees all conceivable > >>>>>> possibilities when he is confronted with a physical problem. > >>>>>> In his mind this becomes transformed into an anticipation of > >>>>>> new phenomena that may some day be verified in actual > experience.... > >>>>>> > >>>>>> The future will give more and more proofs of the merits of Herr > >>>>>> Einstein, and the University that succeeds in attaching him to > itself > >>>>>> may be certain that it will derive honour from its connection with > >>>>>> the > >>>>>> young master. > >>>>>> ======= > >>>>>> > >>>>>> Guess Who? > >>>>>> > >>>>>> Jan > >>>>>> (cheaters will be disqualified) > >>>>>> > >>>>>> > >>>>>> > >>>>>> > >>>>> > >>>>> > >>>>> > >>>>> This forged letter sounds like what Einstein himself would dictate > >>>>> to a > >>>>> "Whodat" type of Bozo to create a recommendation letter. > >>>> > >>>> So denialism is what it is for you. > >>>> > >>>> In the meantime I have dug up he original French text. > >>>> (not bad, for a forger who didn't speak French, Eh?) > >>>> > >>>> As for the letter: Einstein and Poincare had met for the first and > last > >>>> time at the Solvay conference, Oct. 30 to Nov. 2, 1911. > >>>> The letter of recommendation by Curie and Poincare to the ETH, > Zurich, > >>>> was written shortly afterwards. > >>>> Einstein's appointment at the ETH finally came through in July 1912. > >>>> > >>>> It is of course inconceivable that Poincare would have met > Einstein on > >>>> friendly terms at the Solvay, where he had lively discussions with > him, > >>>> (together with Lorentz) and that he would have written this letter of > >>>> recommendation if he had considered Einstein to be a mere plagiarist > >>>> of his own work. > >>>> > >>>> Jan > >>>> > >>>> Letter of Recommendatation > >>>> ==== > >>>> M. Einstein est un des esprits les plus originaux que j'aie connus; > >>> ... > >>> > >>> > >>>> ==== > >>>> Signed,  Mme. Curie and Henri Poincaré > >>> translation by google > >>> > >>> "Mr. Einstein is one of the most original minds I have ever known;" > >>> > >>> Apparently Poincare knew Einstein in person, hence Einstein spoke > >>> French. > >> > >> Poincare no doubt had studied Einstein's publications, > >> and they met in person for thee days at the 1911 Solvay conference. > >> The letter of recommendation was written shortly after that. > >> > >>> But not only was Einstein able to speak French somehow, but apperently > >>> spoke French well. > >> > >> Good enough. It is a matter of record that Lorentz, Einstein, and > >> Poincare had long discussions at the Solvay conference. > >> The language in which is not known, probably a mix of French and > German. > >> Poincare was born in Nancy, Lorraine, close to the French-German > border. > >> His mother was born close to the French-Luxembourg border. > >> The whole Alsace-Lorraine region is effectively bi-lingual. > >> I guess that Poincare, who lived there until age 19, > >> could also speak German well enough. > >> He was certainly capable of reading German. > >> And in case of language problems Lorentz could interpret. > >> > >>> This little fact disturbed me already some time ago, since Einstein > was > >>> by no means a fast learner of any language (as can be seen in his poor > >>> performance in English after ten years at Princton). > >> > >> Not too bad, given that Einstein started learning and speaking English > >> when already in his fifties. > >> > >>> So: where did Einstein learn French? > >> > >> In high school, obviously, and in practice by living in Switzerland for > >> many years. (which is a tri-lingual country) > >> > >>> Most likely Einstein also spoke Italien, because his family lived in > >>> Pavia, Italy and Einstein spent some time there. > >> > >> Yes, that too, somewhat. > >> > >>> Now: German, Italian and French make a set of languages, which are > >>> spoken in Switzerland and no other country. > >>> > >>> The natural question would be, if Einstein had also other relations to > >>> Switzerland. > >> > >> Of course, he was a Swiss citizen, by choice. > >> > >>> Well, actually Einstein had a few: > >>> > >>> went to school in Aarau (Switzerland) > >>> went to university in Zurich (Switzerland) > >>> married, lived and worked in Bern (Switzerland) > >>> spent his live after retirement in Switzerland > >>> has Swiss citizenship > >> > >> Yes, yes, 'Einstein retiring to Switzerland'. > >> Your ability to invent historical 'facts' to suit your prejudices > >> remains amazing, > > > > > > There were certain stations in the life of Einstein, which simply didn't > > make sense: > > > > 1)Einstein remained alone in Germany, after his family moved to Italy. > > But since when is this allowed and even possible? > > > > 2) he quit school and went to Italy, after denouncing German citizenship > > as teenager (afaik at the age of 16). > > But Germans were (and are) a little burocratic and didn't care much > > about the wishes of teenagers.  So how could Einstein possily denouce > > German citizenship? > > > > 3) he went to Pavia, Italy, where his family lived. But he stayed there > > some month without attending school (the enighboring Jesuits wrote on > > their website, that Einstein stayed there for an entire year!). > > So Einstein missed at least a year in school. But why didn't he go to > > school, if he spoke already Italian? > > > > 4) He then went alone to Aarau in Switzerland and went to the Gymnasium > > there. But since when was it allowed (for unattended teenagers) to go to > > Gymnasium there, if they were stateless? > > Four is easy.  Back then there were no computers denying everyone > all sorts of things and tracking everything they did. > > The population of the world had not increased to over 8 billion > people with a lot of increase done in poor countries, and they > gave few government handouts to persons who were called citizens. > > Consider a place called the 'US'.  In 1895 Al Jennings had already ========== REMAINDER OF ARTICLE TRUNCATED ==========