Path: ...!eternal-september.org!feeder3.eternal-september.org!news.eternal-september.org!eternal-september.org!.POSTED!not-for-mail From: olcott Newsgroups: comp.theory Subject: Re: DDD specifies recursive emulation to HHH and halting to HHH1 Date: Fri, 28 Mar 2025 14:05:43 -0500 Organization: A noiseless patient Spider Lines: 65 Message-ID: References: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Injection-Date: Fri, 28 Mar 2025 20:05:44 +0100 (CET) Injection-Info: dont-email.me; posting-host="573eb7050e522f67e4fe879678fe5346"; logging-data="3445926"; mail-complaints-to="abuse@eternal-september.org"; posting-account="U2FsdGVkX18lg2wBhHn4f7AlV3g6oz29" User-Agent: Mozilla Thunderbird Cancel-Lock: sha1:Orx8IO/zhVPr9C7Dx02GHIP5YR4= X-Antivirus: Norton (VPS 250328-4, 3/28/2025), Outbound message Content-Language: en-US In-Reply-To: X-Antivirus-Status: Clean Bytes: 4944 On 3/28/2025 1:07 PM, joes wrote: > Am Fri, 28 Mar 2025 12:57:56 -0500 schrieb olcott: >> On 3/27/2025 9:33 PM, dbush wrote: >>> On 3/27/2025 10:10 PM, olcott wrote: >>>> On 3/27/2025 8:24 PM, dbush wrote: >>>>> On 3/27/2025 9:21 PM, olcott wrote: >>>>>> On 3/27/2025 8:09 PM, dbush wrote: >>>>>>> On 3/27/2025 9:07 PM, olcott wrote: >>>>>>>> On 3/27/2025 7:38 PM, dbush wrote: >>>>>>>>> On 3/27/2025 8:34 PM, olcott wrote: >>>>>>>>>> On 3/27/2025 7:12 PM, dbush wrote: >>>>>>>>>>> On 3/27/2025 8:11 PM, olcott wrote: >>>>>>>>>>>> On 3/27/2025 7:02 PM, dbush wrote: >>>>>>>>>>>>> On 3/27/2025 7:36 PM, olcott wrote: >>>>>>>>>>>>>> On 3/27/2025 1:27 PM, dbush wrote: >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> On 3/27/2025 1:50 PM, olcott wrote: >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> On 3/27/2025 2:18 AM, Fred. Zwarts wrote: >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Op 27.mrt.2025 om 04:09 schreef olcott: >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> On 3/26/2025 8:22 PM, Richard Damon wrote: > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> It is not very interesting to know whether a simulator >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> reports that it is unable to reach the end of the >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> simulation of a program that halts in direct execution. >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> That IS NOT what HHH is reporting. >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> HHH correctly rejects DDD because DDD correctly emulated >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> by HHH cannot possibly reach its own final halt state. >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> In other words, HHH is not a halt decider because it is not >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> computing the required mapping: > >>>>>>>>>> I corrected your error dozens of times and you ignore these >>>>>>>>>> corrections and mindlessly repeat your error like a bot >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> Which is what you've been doing for the last three years. >>>>>>>>> Projection, as always.  I'll add the above to the list. > >>>>>> I did not say that no TM can ever report on behavior that matches >>>>>> the behavior of a directly executing TM. >>>>> >>>>> Good, because that's all that's required for a solution to the >>>>> halting problem: >>>>> >>>> There are sometimes when the behavior of TM Description D correctly >>>> simulated by UTM1 does not match the behavior correctly simulated by >>>> UTM2. >>> >>> Irrelevant, because to satisfy the requirements, the behavior of the >>> described machine when executed directly must be reported. >> >> I HAVE PROVED THAT THE REQUIREMENT IS WRONG NITWIT. >> A FUNCTION THAT IS REQUIRED TO COMPUTE THE SQUARE OF A BOX OF ROCKS IS >> ALSO INCORRECT. > It is wrong to ask for the behaviour of the direct execution? Anyways, > HHH can't do it. > Unless and until one TM can take another executing TM as an input IT IS WRONG TO REQUIRE A TM TO REPORT ON SOMETHING THAT IT CANNOT SEE. -- Copyright 2025 Olcott "Talent hits a target no one else can hit; Genius hits a target no one else can see." Arthur Schopenhauer