Path: ...!eternal-september.org!feeder3.eternal-september.org!news.eternal-september.org!eternal-september.org!.POSTED!not-for-mail From: olcott Newsgroups: sci.logic,comp.theory Subject: Re: How the requirements that Professor Sipser agreed to are exactly met Followup-To: comp.theory Date: Tue, 13 May 2025 08:54:15 -0500 Organization: A noiseless patient Spider Lines: 57 Message-ID: References: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Injection-Date: Tue, 13 May 2025 15:54:18 +0200 (CEST) Injection-Info: dont-email.me; posting-host="43745e07502355f27fac5eed8a7d2487"; logging-data="1945855"; mail-complaints-to="abuse@eternal-september.org"; posting-account="U2FsdGVkX1/PqZFO+tIE1SCUfRUqqK3z" User-Agent: Mozilla Thunderbird Cancel-Lock: sha1:F5b3Y7f2vTtskq+1D5lc8RHIAas= Content-Language: en-US X-Antivirus-Status: Clean In-Reply-To: X-Antivirus: Norton (VPS 250513-2, 5/13/2025), Outbound message Bytes: 3122 On 5/13/2025 2:41 AM, Mikko wrote: > On 2025-05-12 18:17:37 +0000, olcott said: > >> Introduction to the Theory of Computation 3rd Edition >> by Michael Sipser (Author) >> 4.4 out of 5 stars    568 rating >> >> https://www.amazon.com/Introduction-Theory-Computation-Michael-Sipser/ >> dp/113318779X >> >> int DD() >>   { >>    int Halt_Status = HHH(DD); >>    if (Halt_Status) >>      HERE: goto HERE; >>    return Halt_Status; >>   } >> >> DD correctly simulated by any pure simulator >> named HHH cannot possibly terminate thus proving >> that this criteria has been met: >> >> >>      If simulating halt decider H correctly simulates its >>      input D until H correctly determines that its simulated D >>      would never stop running unless aborted then > > This specifies two requirements: > 1. H correctly simulates that part of the behaviour of D that starts > from the start of the execution and does not end before the second > requirement is satisfied. > 2. H correctly determines that unsimulated part of the behaviour is > infinitely long. > > The second reuirement is not satisfied when HHH analyses the above > DD. > In other words you believe that DD will halt on its own without ever being aborted by HHH. That is counter-factual. _DD() [00002133] 55 push ebp ; housekeeping [00002134] 8bec mov ebp,esp ; housekeeping [00002136] 51 push ecx ; make space for local [00002137] 6833210000 push 00002133 ; push DD [0000213c] e882f4ffff call 000015c3 ; call HHH(DD) .... HHH determines that DD correctly simulated by HHH keeps calling HHH(DD) until HHH aborts this simulation and rejects DD. -- Copyright 2025 Olcott "Talent hits a target no one else can hit; Genius hits a target no one else can see." Arthur Schopenhauer