Path: news.eternal-september.org!eternal-september.org!.POSTED!not-for-mail From: olcott Newsgroups: comp.theory,sci.logic,comp.ai.philosophy Subject: Re: HHH(DD) does correctly reject its input as non-halting --- VERIFIED FACT Date: Sat, 14 Jun 2025 08:38:48 -0500 Organization: A noiseless patient Spider Lines: 62 Message-ID: <102ju18$793t$1@dont-email.me> References: <102erpt$2ohps$5@dont-email.me> <102gvs0$3d4cf$1@dont-email.me> <102hhhn$3gqbm$5@dont-email.me> <102jeak$3avu$1@dont-email.me> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Injection-Date: Sat, 14 Jun 2025 15:38:49 +0200 (CEST) Injection-Info: dont-email.me; posting-host="bb7bd0e2eb35212c3f1546592393724a"; logging-data="238717"; mail-complaints-to="abuse@eternal-september.org"; posting-account="U2FsdGVkX19W73MAnFh08lkq7NLNnYQg" User-Agent: Mozilla Thunderbird Cancel-Lock: sha1:ygx7SuTkKS4CnVZdHgYLGieaKII= X-Antivirus: Norton (VPS 250614-2, 6/14/2025), Outbound message In-Reply-To: <102jeak$3avu$1@dont-email.me> Content-Language: en-US X-Antivirus-Status: Clean On 6/14/2025 4:10 AM, Fred. Zwarts wrote: > Op 13.jun.2025 om 17:53 schreef olcott: >> On 6/13/2025 5:51 AM, Mikko wrote: >>> On 2025-06-12 15:30:05 +0000, olcott said: >>> >>>> int DD() >>>> { >>>>    int Halt_Status = HHH(DD); >>>>    if (Halt_Status) >>>>      HERE: goto HERE; >>>>    return Halt_Status; >>>> } >>>> >>>> It is a verified fact that DD() *is* one of the forms >>>> of the counter-example input as such an input would >>>> be encoded in C. Christopher Strachey wrote his in CPL. >>>> >>>> // rec routine P >>>> //   §L :if T[P] go to L >>>> //     Return § >>>> // https://academic.oup.com/comjnl/article/7/4/313/354243 >>>> void Strachey_P() >>>> { >>>>    L: if (HHH(Strachey_P)) goto L; >>>>    return; >>>> } >>>> >>>> https://academic.oup.com/comjnl/article-abstract/7/4/313/354243? >>>> redirectedFrom=fulltext >>> >>> Strachey only informally presents the idea of the proof. Formalism >>> and details needed in a rigorous proof is not shown. >>> >> >> void DDD() >> { >>    HHH(DDD); >>    return; >> } >> >> _DDD() >> [00002192] 55             push ebp >> [00002193] 8bec           mov ebp,esp >> [00002195] 6892210000     push 00002192 >> [0000219a] e833f4ffff     call 000015d2  // call HHH >> [0000219f] 83c404         add esp,+04 >> [000021a2] 5d             pop ebp >> [000021a3] c3             ret >> Size in bytes:(0018) [000021a3] >> >> Exactly how would DDD correctly emulated by HHH >> reach its own "ret" instruction final halt state? > > Indeed, HHH fails where other world-class simulators have no problem to > simulate the program specified in the input. > So you still don't understand what recursive simulation is? -- Copyright 2025 Olcott "Talent hits a target no one else can hit; Genius hits a target no one else can see." Arthur Schopenhauer