Path: nntp.eternal-september.org!news.eternal-september.org!eternal-september.org!.POSTED!not-for-mail
From: olcott <polcott333@gmail.com>
Newsgroups: comp.theory
Subject: Re: My reviewers think that halt deciders must report on the behavior
 of their caller
Date: Mon, 14 Jul 2025 08:19:15 -0500
Organization: A noiseless patient Spider
Lines: 79
Message-ID: <105304j$3dptv$3@dont-email.me>
References: <101nq32$99vd$1@dont-email.me>
 <a346224cd5d8b4001580eb6e5ff8783e58c9b7f5@i2pn2.org>
 <104e46s$28pqb$2@dont-email.me>
 <960c2417e6f691b2b12703506c207990df5b39ab@i2pn2.org>
 <104el09$2dpog$1@dont-email.me>
 <1ca786773f9ff02718c66e082bbc4182b36732ab@i2pn2.org>
 <104fduv$2n8gq$2@dont-email.me>
 <4cb5d16be8d1e6549823f35081050e7dad462da2@i2pn2.org>
 <104gi8j$2uc68$2@dont-email.me>
 <152859a4a4ef31aa45580e873eb6970c34b97ef9@i2pn2.org>
 <104hmb5$35gkb$1@dont-email.me>
 <f12be9e3474cf08b01ae1a4381f77205bbac1da3@i2pn2.org>
 <104i15g$36mma$2@dont-email.me>
 <c0cf1db3b26b15b6b2df8a22e9f415c10aee59a7@i2pn2.org>
 <104jcqn$3jrpl$10@dont-email.me> <104lb03$13ioh$2@dont-email.me>
 <104lp8o$7l4q$7@dont-email.me> <104o662$18h8g$1@dont-email.me>
 <104oj2v$t0u4$7@dont-email.me> <104qimm$1dpnl$1@dont-email.me>
 <104rad9$1icss$3@dont-email.me> <104t4na$21rg3$1@dont-email.me>
 <104tra1$264oq$2@dont-email.me> <104vm2f$2ldm1$1@dont-email.me>
 <1050in9$2qkok$3@dont-email.me> <1052gji$3au6g$1@dont-email.me>
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8; format=flowed
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
Injection-Date: Mon, 14 Jul 2025 15:19:16 +0200 (CEST)
Injection-Info: dont-email.me; posting-host="e10498e6bc9f284a7eed933d9123bd8c";
	logging-data="3598271"; mail-complaints-to="abuse@eternal-september.org";	posting-account="U2FsdGVkX1/pUjMSzJ0aZjyQV8tyaRmj"
User-Agent: Mozilla Thunderbird
Cancel-Lock: sha1:Kz53b+OehL81da3iu6nJ/4HL7ow=
In-Reply-To: <1052gji$3au6g$1@dont-email.me>
X-Antivirus: Norton (VPS 250714-2, 7/14/2025), Outbound message
X-Antivirus-Status: Clean
Content-Language: en-US

On 7/14/2025 3:54 AM, Mikko wrote:
> On 2025-07-13 15:18:01 +0000, olcott said:
> 
>> On 7/13/2025 2:09 AM, Mikko wrote:
>>> On 2025-07-12 14:26:09 +0000, olcott said:
>>>
>>>> On 7/12/2025 3:00 AM, Mikko wrote:
>>>>> On 2025-07-11 15:25:29 +0000, olcott said:
>>>>>
>>>>>> On 7/11/2025 3:40 AM, Mikko wrote:
>>>>>>> On 2025-07-10 14:35:11 +0000, olcott said:
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> On 7/10/2025 5:54 AM, Fred. Zwarts wrote:
>>>>>>>>> Op 09.jul.2025 om 15:02 schreef olcott:>
>>>>>>>>>> All Turing machine deciders only compute the mapping
>>>>>>>>>> from their actual inputs. This entails that they never
>>>>>>>>>> compute any mapping from non-inputs.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> At least one thing you understand.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> *From the bottom of page 319 has been adapted to this*
>>>>>>>> https://www.liarparadox.org/Peter_Linz_HP_317-320.pdf
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> *The Linz proof does not understand this*
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Proofs don't understand. They prove.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> It fails to prove undecidability when the decider
>>>>>> correctly excludes directly executed Turing machines
>>>>>> from its domain.
>>>>>
>>>>> That does not change the last sentence of the proof. Therefore the
>>>>> proof proves what it would prove anyway.
>>>>
>>>> It completely invalidates the proof.
>>>
>>> No, it does not. The proof reamins as it was. A proof is valid if there
>>> is no error in the proof. Nothing else is relevant.
>>
>> There are errors that you do not understand.
> 
> For the purpose of these discussion it is not neessary to understand
> your errors beyond that they are errors. 

int DD()
{
   int Halt_Status = HHH(DD);
   if (Halt_Status)
     HERE: goto HERE;
   return Halt_Status;
}

*There are errors with the proof*

(1) Simulating terminator HHH makes the second line
of code unreachable for DDD simulated by HHH according
to the semantics of the C programming language.
*No one ever noticed that before my work*

(2) This makes the conventional halting problem proof
counter-example input decidable when decided on the
basis of the actual behavior that its input actually
specifies.

(3) Halt deciders only report on the behavior that their
input actually specifies even though some textbooks
disagree.

> This group is not for those
> who want to understand errors but for those how want to understand
> more about the theory of computations. All readers need to know about
> you is that what you say is not the understanding they seek.
> 


-- 
Copyright 2025 Olcott "Talent hits a target no one else can hit; Genius
hits a target no one else can see." Arthur Schopenhauer