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From: Rhino <no_offline_contact@example.com>
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Subject: Re: Superman (1978) John Williams' score
Date: Wed, 26 Jun 2024 17:32:53 -0400
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On Wed, 26 Jun 2024 19:57:48 -0000 (UTC)
"Adam H. Kerman" <ahk@chinet.com> wrote:

> BTR1701 <atropos@mac.com> wrote:
> >"Adam H. Kerman" <ahk@chinet.com> wrote:  
> 
> >>Throughout June, TCM was playing various movies to celebrate the
> >>scores of Hollywood's best-known composers. To honor John Williams,
> >>they chose to play Superman. In the host's comments, it was new
> >>information to me that Jerry Goldsmith had turned the movie down as
> >>he was scoring something else, although you'd think the guy who
> >>scored Chinatown over a weekend after the earlier composer was
> >>fired would been able to do it, just by never sleeping for two
> >>months.  
> 
> >>It's a great score, but it's always always always annoyed me that
> >>you cannot hear the score properly over the opening titles because
> >>of all the whooshing noises as each title flies by. I've always
> >>hated that. Salkind hired the guy who had just received an Oscar
> >>for Jaws, so I think the audience really wants to hear the music.  
> 
> >>Yes, I know the main theme is derivative (of previous works of his
> >>own, plus the usual romantic composers that movie music is supposed
> >>to sound like), but the first four notes of that one major theme in
> >>the music conveys such a sense of joy and optimism, it's just
> >>perfect.  
> 
> >So much of the criticism many film composers have of "being
> >derivative" is wholly undeserved. Almost every time it's done
> >specifically and intentionally by the composer on orders from the
> >director.  
> 
> >For example, the opening scene of STAR WARS, with the huge Imperial
> >Star Destroyer rumbling in overhead, almost endlessly. People say
> >Williams just lifted that part of the score from Holst's "Mars" from
> >"The Planets", but the reality is that Lucas actually temp-tracked
> >that scene with Mars and when Williams came in to score it, Lucas
> >kept sending him notes saying, "Make it sound more like Mars. I
> >really like the sound of Mars there." So Williams basically mimicked
> >Holst's piece as close as he could without risking a copyright
> >violation.  
> 
> >So now all these years later, we have lackbrains like Hutt claiming 
> >Williams all but plagiarized Mars in STAR WARS.  
> 
> >The same is true for so many composers whose creativity is leashed
> >by whatever the director wants, not what they can actually produce.  
> 
> But from what I've read about Spielberg, he loved movie scores and as
> a surrogate audience member, he knew what movie soundtracks were
> supposed to sound like.
> 
> Even if derivative, Williams's job was to make it sound right and work
> incidentally to the scene. Generally, he succeeds enormously.
> 
> >>One of the pieces I really like is "Welcome to Krypton" (I really
> >>have no idea what it's called), slightly reminiscent of Aaron
> >>Copland and early Charles Ives.  
> 
> >1M1 Prelude / 1M1A The Planet Krypton  
> 
> Fair enough; nice nostalgic American music works great
> 
> >>Gene Hackman's Lex Luthor isn't the way I ever pictured Lex Luthor
> >>but he made it work. Of course it would have been better to create
> >>an all-new character for the movie. Why was Valerie Perrine a
> >>henchwoman? Yes, she got to distract Major Nelson in that one scene
> >> 
> 
> >Which doesn't age well, as a bunch of soldiers surround a pretty
> >girl passed out on the side of the road and instead of summoning
> >medical help, they all giggle and start planning on how they're
> >going to sexually assault her.  
> 
> Was much of the movie's broader humor funny at the time? Lex's crimes
> were pretty damn horrific, intending to kill 10s of millions. I
> suppose he's killed more than that at other times. Do we need a scene
> to lighten the moment to use a sexy female "victim" to distract idiot
> naval officers and sailors mismanaging their duties? Or the gag with
> Otis failing to input the coordinates Lex gave him?
> 
> The subtler humor worked. I remember the audience's laughter when
> Clark couldn't find a phone booth to change into costume in.
> 
> Explain that gag to kids today. What's a phone booth? What's a pay
> phone? What's a phone?

Kids today will have no problem knowing what a phone is.
They WILL wonder why he doesn't just reach into his pocket to get his
phone out, just like they do. 

-- 
Rhino