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NNTP-Posting-Date: Mon, 20 May 2024 17:46:30 +0000
Subject: Re: Can Jews be Nazis?
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From: % <pursent100@gmail.com>
Date: Mon, 20 May 2024 10:46:30 -0700
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bitrex wrote:
> On 5/20/2024 1:26 PM, john larkin wrote:
>> On Mon, 20 May 2024 09:33:29 -0700, % <pursent100@gmail.com> wrote:
>>
>>> john larkin wrote:
>>>> On Mon, 20 May 2024 11:40:06 -0400, bitrex <user@example.net> wrote:
>>>>
>>>>> On 5/20/2024 9:57 AM, john larkin wrote:
>>>>>> On Sun, 19 May 24 23:57:56 UTC, NefeshBarYochai <void@invalid.noy>
>>>>>> wrote:
>>>>>>
>>>>>>> BY STEPHEN F. EISENMAN
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> For many people, the question is inflammatory. The crimes of the
>>>>>>> German Nazis were of such magnitude that comparison with any other
>>>>>>> historical violence is invidious. The genocide of the Jews was
>>>>>>> deliberate and methodical and intended to eliminate every last one.
>>>>>>> The goal was the same with the Romani and Sinti people. By 
>>>>>>> comparison,
>>>>>>> the Israelis – currently accused of genocide — are rank amateurs. 
>>>>>>> They
>>>>>>> have so far killed some 35,000 Palestinians in Gaza out of a
>>>>>>> population of 2.3 million.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> But the question, “Can Jews be Nazis?” is nevertheless important for
>>>>>>> challenging claims of moral inoculation by virtue of the Jewish
>>>>>>> experience of the Holocaust. If Israeli leaders are indeed 
>>>>>>> committing
>>>>>>> a genocide in Gaza – as seems the case — they inhabit the same moral
>>>>>>> universe as the German Nazis, regardless of the suffering of past
>>>>>>> generations. In addition to the 35,000 killed, the war in Gaza has
>>>>>>> injured another 75,000 and displaced 2 million. Most of the victims
>>>>>>> are women and children – how can their deaths be justified? Israeli
>>>>>>> cabinet ministers, Knesset members, military personnel, and police
>>>>>>> have all freely spoken of their wish to force Palestinians into 
>>>>>>> Egypt,
>>>>>>> establish Jewish-only settlements in Gaza, and even use an atomic 
>>>>>>> bomb
>>>>>>> to kill everyone in the Gaza strip. (U.S. senator Lindsay Graham
>>>>>>> recently also suggested using a nuclear weapon against Gaza.)
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> At the end of WWII, German cities and industry were heaps of burnt
>>>>>> rubble, much worse than Gaza today. Half of Germany was occupied by
>>>>>> the USSR. About 6 million jews had been starved and gassed to 
>>>>>> death by
>>>>>> the nazis. About 100 million people died in WWII.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Israel wants to survive and is arguably doing what it must do to
>>>>>> survive. The bad guys aren't Israel, they are Iran and Hamas and the
>>>>>> many other savages, kidnappers, bombers, and rapists.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> The extreme islamists want to kill all the jews and take their land.
>>>>>> The citizens of Israel of course object. Thay have atom bombs and
>>>>>> havedn't used them, even after the drons attacks from Iran.
>>>>>
>>>>> If heavily nuclear-armed nations still routinely feel in great 
>>>>> danger of
>>>>> their sovereignty and land being taken then it's hard to know what 
>>>>> else
>>>>> to do for them that could make them feel any safer.
>>>>>
>>>>>> Long-term, Israel can't allow Iran to have nukes, because they know
>>>>>> that Iran will use them on Israeli cities and welcome retaliation as
>>>>>> blessed martyrdom.
>>>>
>>>> Exacrly.  What's scary is that the extremist islamists are eager for
>>>> martyrdom, especially somebody else's. The lunatics in Iran may think
>>>> that a nuclear exchange is worth it if it kills a lot of jews.
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> Iran has probably noticed that no nuclear-armed state has ever been
>>>>> conquered, it's unclear if Israel knows.
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> The Iranian leadership no doubt has nuke-proof tunnel complexes, built
>>>> at great expense. Strange how some people like to live underground.
>>>> Sounds nasty and stinky to me.
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>> anything to bugger the americans ,
>>> who want to lay claim to all the land
>>
>> The US has not forcibly acquired land since the war with Mexico. The
>> central USA and Alaska were purchased. The people of Alaska and Hawaii
>> voted to become states. The people of Puerto Rico can vote to be a
>> state or to be an independent country.
>>
>> Some countries and their kings or dictators, throughout history, have
>> wanted to acquire territory, even when they are busy trashing their
>> own conntries. That is really weird and it's still happening now.
>> Stupid tribalism.
>>
> 
> The US operates 750 military bases in 80 countries worldwide, so it's a 
> bit strange to hear other Americans speculate on which _other_ world 
> powers are the "militant and aggressively expansionist" ones.
> 
> My hypothesis: you could close 3/4ths of them and materially nothing 
> would change geopolitically or for the lives or day-to-day safety of any 
> average American, either short or long-term.
> 
> The US also maintains about 1500 deployed nuclear weapons and Russia 
> about the same. Could cut that down to about 50 each and this would be 
> nothing but a good deal. Having 1500 ready to go clearly didn't prevent 
> Russia from invading anyone, or allow us to prevent it from happening!
> 
> Weapons that you can never use but are enormously expensive to maintain 
> (and have a very non-negligible chance of accidentally causing a 
> civilization-wrecking catastrophe) are pretty dubious value.
> 
> Gorbachev purportedly pitched a similar idea but Reagan rejected it, he 
> thought Star Wars had a chance of being something other than make-work.
> 
> 
i'm glad you get the picture