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From: Brett <ggtgp@yahoo.com>
Newsgroups: comp.arch
Subject: Re: Is Intel exceptionally unsuccessful as an architecture designer?
Date: Sat, 21 Sep 2024 16:23:38 -0000 (UTC)
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Chris M. Thomasson <chris.m.thomasson.1@gmail.com> wrote:
> On 9/20/2024 6:12 PM, Brett wrote:
>> MitchAlsup1 <mitchalsup@aol.com> wrote:
>>> On Fri, 20 Sep 2024 21:54:36 +0000, Chris M. Thomasson wrote:
>>> 
>>>> On 9/20/2024 2:32 PM, Lawrence D'Oliveiro wrote:
>>>>> On Fri, 20 Sep 2024 11:21:52 -0400, Stefan Monnier wrote:
>>>>> 
>>>>>>> The basic issue is:
>>>>>>> * CPU+motherboard RAM -- usually upgradeable
>>>>>>> * Addon coprocessor RAM -- usually not upgradeable
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> Maybe the RAM of the "addon coprocessor" is not upgradeable, but the
>>>>>> addon board itself can be replaced with another one (one with more RAM).
>>>>> 
>>>>> Yes, but that’s a lot more expensive.
>>>> 
>>>> I had this crazy idea of putting cpus right on the ram. So, if you add
>>>> more memory to your system you automatically get more cpu's... Think
>>>> NUMA for a moment... ;^)
>>> 
>>> Can software use the extra CPUs ?
>>> 
>>> Also note: DRAMs are made on P-Channel process (leakage) with only a few
>>> layer of metal while CPUs are based on a N-Channel process (speed) with
>>> many layers of metal.
>> 
>> Didn’t you work on the MC68000 which had one layer of metal?
>> 
>> This could be fine if you are going for the AI market of slow AI cpu with
>> huge memory and bandwidth.
>> 
>> The AI market is bigger than the general server market as seen in NVidea’s
>> sales.
>> 
>>> Bus interconnects are not setup to take a CPU cache miss from one
>>> DRAM to a different DRAM on behalf of its contained CPU(s).
>>> {Chicken and egg problem}
>> 
>> Such a dram would be on the PCIE busses, and the main CPU’s would barely
>> touch that ram, and the AI only searches locally.
> 
> My crazy idea would be akin to a motherboard with a processor and a 
> bunch of slots. One would be filled with a special memory with cpu's on 
> it. If the user wants to add more memory they would gain extra cpu's. It 
> would be a NUMA like scheme. Programs running on cpus with _very_ local 
> ram would be happy. The main cpu's on the motherboard can be physically 
> close to the ram slots as well. Adding more memory means we have access 
> to more cpus that are very close to the memory. So, it might be 
> interesting out there in the middle of fantasy land for a moment... ;^o 
> Ouch!

The newest Intel CPU’s have the dram on the socket, like the iPhone, you
get four times the bandwidth. With no DIMM sockets instead of dual socket
servers you get 4 and 8 socket servers.

What you are asking for is coming today. ;)

I have a bunch of dual socket servers that only have one socket populated,
bottom price tier.

> The manual says if you don't need to share data, don't do it... Right on 
> the cover! lol. ;^D
>